Snickers

hmmm that's interesting. I know they hire from all walks of life but I was thinking if there is a point system then there should (in theory) be a way to make your application more attractive if you could get the things that would give you enough points, right? Obviously, you can't just go to Walmart and pick up some heavy time but if you know what they want then it's easy to differentiate yourself. For example, a friend of mine who recently got on at another carrier said the computer that receives the resumes and applications is looking for keywords like "FMS experience", "Glass Cockpit" or other words that are synonymous to the company's values. It's not really what you've done, it's how you worded it and how the computer interprets it.

And yes, I was referring to the box in the PAQ. I just looked at mine and if I add three people's names and job titles the font gets so small that there is no way anyone would be able to read it. I only have the person I am closest to listed. Is that hurting me, or am I getting the same points as someone who has say three?

NightIP

+1...

All of us newer pilots are ready to swing for the fences. I've had a couple 15+ year guys tell me that we'll hurt the company's competitiveness by shooting for better in 2016, though. True story.

DC8DRIVER

While we should shoot for the moon, I'll settle for AA pay scales. 12 year 747 Capt. at $241/hr. 12 year 747 FO at 164/hr. 16% 401K DC Contribution starting 1/2014. Future contractual pay raises: Variable percentage every year through 2018. Pay parity review with UA and DL in 2016. And I wouldn't expect to "see the others ratchet down in the next couple of years" with DAL net profit in 2013 at 10.54 Billion dollars and UAL at 571 Million.

While it sounds like you have all the answers that nobody else ever could about the next contract perhaps we should listen to alternative ideas until the union opens contract talks, sort of like CRM. However, this particular thread is probably not the best place to air out explicit "discussions" about ideas for the next contract. What readers of a hiring thread about Atlas should probably see are the basic plusses and minuses of our current contract, and the fact that we are working hard to make significant improvements in the next one. Anything else could veer a discussion about Atlas hiring waaaay off course.

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744driver

I'm one of those guys that's been here a long time...and guess what?...I'm not one bit interested in leaving money on the table. In fact, my style of negotiations will likely involve reaching across the table and grabbing money out of their pockets.

Let us not worry about guys that are only a couple of years away from retirement, but seem to be convincing us that it is okay to sit back, and negotiate by saying, "please, Mr Atlas, can we have a few dollars more?".

Disclaimer...ATCsaidDoWhat is on our side, trust me...I know him and his credentials are enviable. The ones I'm referring to are the ones on our private forum elsewhere that beat that drum about accepting only a little bit more each time we sit down with the company...you know the ones.

Sorry, it is way time for you, me, and all those hired in the last 5 years to take a stand and say, enough...and let us bring those naysayers to our side.

Thoughts?...!!

Rant over, now back to the hiring discussion (after I toss a grenade, right?!!)

JonnyKnoxville

Wow...where do I begin?

You may have been around a lot longer than I have but you certainly have not been paying attention.

Others ratchet down...

Pattern bargaining is happening as it always has. The concession stand is closed. Major CBA gains have taken place at multiple airlines and they will each trump one another as these airlines are all turning record profits.

Other carriers merged (United and Continental, Delta and Northwest, American and US Airways) and all used their leverage from each merger to make major contractual gains. We threw that leverage away.

This next January:

Atlas Captain $209.14

American $238.71 (American snaps to the average of Delta and United in January 2016. I would take that $30 an hour pay raise now and the almost $65 pay raise for 2016, you wouldn't?)
Delta $276.75
FedEx $269.61
United $268.88
UPS $268.17

Saying that hourly pay is the tip of the iceberg would be an understatement.

Our monthly guarantee is one of the lowest in the industry, even the regionals are in the mid 70s.
Deadhead Pay: the airlines with bad contracts get 50% pay, most get 100% pay, we get 35% pay.
We lack the most basic day or duty rigs.
Trip rig at 4.85 hours paid in a 24 hour period of a trip while everyone else is paid over 6 hours in a 24 hour period of a trip.

I love how you scold me for coming up with my own ideas right before you introduce your own ideas about retirement.

By the way, I would not take a pension plan even if the company was giving it away for free...are you nuts?

Other than FedEx pilots (who would lose their pension if the company ever declares bankruptcy), who still has a pension? Bankruptcy took them all away and it would only be a matter of time before they did that to us. (I guess you do not have this t-shirt, but I do)

Fact: 401k plans can not be taken away by the company, they are the way of the present and the way of the future.

This transition from pension plans to 401ks has only been happening across the country since the mid 1980's.

All of the other top tier airlines now have 16% contribution of a pilot's W2 pay deposited into their 401k account. Pilot participation is not required for this benefit. We get a 5% match if we contribute...pathetic

Why do I feel like I am wasting my time even explaining all of this to you?

Don't get me wrong, I like working at Atlas. However, the financial difference in compensation over a pilot's career would number in the millions.

CandlerKid

You are wasting your breath. The senior guys have ZERO clue about the rest of the industry. The FO's and ex-Polar crews have the majority for the next contract vote, so don't let them get to you. Sadly they don't care if the bottom half of the list were to leave either. They don't think it will affect them. Good luck getting contracts to fly with no pilots to staff the planes.

DC8DRIVER

I have never heard of a computer scanning system used here for resumes and there is no way to know how the point system (if, indeed, there is one?) works. I think there is a way to get additional names on the PAQ if you have the most up to date Adobe software.

From the many recently hired pilots I have come across in the past 2.5 years, my impression is that there is little emphasis placed on any one particular column of experience/background (with the exception of some current '76 pilots that were fast-tracked when we started that program). There are heavy pilots who are weak in glass/FMS systems. There are regional guys who thrive on 17 day trips and multiple schedule changes. There seems to be no one industry segment that is highly preferred.

Atlas seems to place the most weight on the individual who will thrive under the peculiar conditions we have at Atlas. They want pilots who have done their homework and know a lot about the working conditions here and still really want the job. They also seem to hire a lot of guys who will be easy to get along with in the cockpit during a 16 hour flight.

Sorry to be so vague, but that is the way it appears to me. Of course you should emphasize your strengths whether it be C-5 or RJ time, glass cockpit, ocean crossings, IP, Check Airman, whatever. Just be sure that you have done your homework because the people I know who were not chosen after an interview didn't know the company or didn't know how they would fit in.

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John Carr

Agree with all your points, and it can get a little complicated;

This is from the UAL CBA;

JonnyKnoxville

No worries:

5-G-3 Schedules shall contain a minimum of one (1) hour pay value for each three and one-half (3.5) hours elapsed time away from Base, prorated, on a schedule or actual basis, whichever is greater.

24 hours divided by 3.5 hours = 6.857 hours paid in a 24 hour period.

Although 5-G-2 includes the word trip, it is really their day rig. 5-G-3 is the trip rig.

John Carr

Touche *****cat.

Skipped that as the guys I know (on reserve) seem to usually have the former section usually apply.