The airlines are creating the Pilot Shortage
06-28-2012, 07:01 AM
#141
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Joined APC: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,134
Originally Posted by USMCFLYR
Yep - sounds like your industry management has some strong pull doesn't it? Like I said before, is it the FAA since OTHER changes have happened so quickly, or is it your industries pull with lobbyists and congress?
No you didn't - nor did I say that you did. I made it very clear that I was asking a questoin of the other poster.
I didn't say "why should they [care about FTDT regs)", I asked 'why would they be complaining about them'. You have read my post wrong which is maybe why you seem so confrontation with my post when I am saying the same thing about FTDT and the problems with getting them implemented.
That is EXACTLY what I am saying and another reason why I think that you are misreading my posts. I was comparing them because that is my exact point. The FAA has much stricter FTDT regs and the pilots and the union and the leadership would cry foul if they tried to work us like they do the P135 freight dogs.
Don't forget your Senators and Congressmen/women who are playing along.
USMCFLYR
No you didn't - nor did I say that you did. I made it very clear that I was asking a questoin of the other poster.
I didn't say "why should they [care about FTDT regs)", I asked 'why would they be complaining about them'. You have read my post wrong which is maybe why you seem so confrontation with my post when I am saying the same thing about FTDT and the problems with getting them implemented.
That is EXACTLY what I am saying and another reason why I think that you are misreading my posts. I was comparing them because that is my exact point. The FAA has much stricter FTDT regs and the pilots and the union and the leadership would cry foul if they tried to work us like they do the P135 freight dogs.
Don't forget your Senators and Congressmen/women who are playing along.
USMCFLYR
06-28-2012, 07:07 AM
#142
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Joined APC: May 2012
Posts: 192
Originally Posted by Cruz5350
Where is this nice apartment at in Atlanta? My "nice" apartment runs me $900 a month not including any utilities sure you could probably go way outside the city or live in BFE and find a place for $700, but then you're stuck driving to work in the worst city traffic in the country. That's not a joke it's rated number 1 worst and after I come home from work the last thing I want to do is be stuck in traffic here. $25K after tax leaves you with maybe $1750 a month you can kiss at least $1k away on rent and utilities. $750 doesn't leave much for other bills food and beer. Trust everyone when they are giving you their advice here they are either living it or have lived it once or twice before.
How are regional airlines going to get new-hires then if they continue to pay such low salaries, especially with the increased attrition in the coming years? They must increase pay to attract new pilots, right?
06-28-2012, 07:26 AM
#143
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Joined APC: Apr 2007
Position: 320
Posts: 709
Originally Posted by skylover
I understand. Obviously my budget must have been a little underestimated, because on paper it didn't look as bad as what you're describing.
How are regional airlines going to get new-hires then if they continue to pay such low salaries, especially with the increased attrition in the coming years? They must increase pay to attract new pilots, right?
How are regional airlines going to get new-hires then if they continue to pay such low salaries, especially with the increased attrition in the coming years? They must increase pay to attract new pilots, right?
06-28-2012, 07:31 AM
#144
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Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: FAA 'Flight Check'
Posts: 13,837
Originally Posted by xjtguy
I'm not being confrontational, I just don't see how you can say gov't red tape is a valid reason. Not with as long as its been going on.
Because no matter the issue - NOTHING goes quickly through the sea of red tape when the gov't is involved. Some things might go quicker than others, but it is still bogged down. Red tape certainly has something to do with the process timeline, but I think that BIG BUSINESS (meaning the airline management and their interests) is the NUMBER ONE/MAJORITY cause of the exceedingly long timeline, and even still the slow progress and dilution of, the proposed rules.
And are you saying that ONLY 135 has outdated/archaic FTDT regs? 121 isn't really much better and has been LONG overdue as well.
USMCFLYR
06-28-2012, 07:43 AM
#145
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Joined APC: Jan 2008
Position: the correct seat
Posts: 1,422
Skylover,
I'd like to see the budget your parents made. I'm sure 25k doesn't go very far, esp in a big city like ATL.
You seem to romanticise flying. I'm not gonna jump down your throat, because I was there once. I won't tell you not to fly, but I'll tell you that if there's anything else you'd rather do, go that route instead.
What a lot of airline hopefuls don't realize until it's too late is that it's a job. The novelty of flying a jet at 140kt on final approach wears off very quickly. Consider this- when you're building your cross country time flying to different towns, at some point, you'll be up there and itching to land because you've got something to do. Same thing as an airline pilot, except that you don't just fly on the days you feel like it, to cities you feel like. You will have almost no control of where your fly, who you fly with, when you fly, or how often you fly. Sometimes all the factors will line up against you, but you've still got to get the job done.
I'd like to see the budget your parents made. I'm sure 25k doesn't go very far, esp in a big city like ATL.
You seem to romanticise flying. I'm not gonna jump down your throat, because I was there once. I won't tell you not to fly, but I'll tell you that if there's anything else you'd rather do, go that route instead.
What a lot of airline hopefuls don't realize until it's too late is that it's a job. The novelty of flying a jet at 140kt on final approach wears off very quickly. Consider this- when you're building your cross country time flying to different towns, at some point, you'll be up there and itching to land because you've got something to do. Same thing as an airline pilot, except that you don't just fly on the days you feel like it, to cities you feel like. You will have almost no control of where your fly, who you fly with, when you fly, or how often you fly. Sometimes all the factors will line up against you, but you've still got to get the job done.
06-28-2012, 07:58 AM
#146
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Joined APC: May 2012
Posts: 192
Originally Posted by Senior Skipper
Skylover,
I'd like to see the budget your parents made. I'm sure 25k doesn't go very far, esp in a big city like ATL.
You seem to romanticise flying. I'm not gonna jump down your throat, because I was there once. I won't tell you not to fly, but I'll tell you that if there's anything else you'd rather do, go that route instead.
What a lot of airline hopefuls don't realize until it's too late is that it's a job. The novelty of flying a jet at 140kt on final approach wears off very quickly. Consider this- when you're building your cross country time flying to different towns, at some point, you'll be up there and itching to land because you've got something to do. Same thing as an airline pilot, except that you don't just fly on the days you feel like it, to cities you feel like. You will have almost no control of where your fly, who you fly with, when you fly, or how often you fly. Sometimes all the factors will line up against you, but you've still got to get the job done.
I'd like to see the budget your parents made. I'm sure 25k doesn't go very far, esp in a big city like ATL.
You seem to romanticise flying. I'm not gonna jump down your throat, because I was there once. I won't tell you not to fly, but I'll tell you that if there's anything else you'd rather do, go that route instead.
What a lot of airline hopefuls don't realize until it's too late is that it's a job. The novelty of flying a jet at 140kt on final approach wears off very quickly. Consider this- when you're building your cross country time flying to different towns, at some point, you'll be up there and itching to land because you've got something to do. Same thing as an airline pilot, except that you don't just fly on the days you feel like it, to cities you feel like. You will have almost no control of where your fly, who you fly with, when you fly, or how often you fly. Sometimes all the factors will line up against you, but you've still got to get the job done.
The only other career path I've ever considered is marketing/brand management. But I have a hard time stomaching a 9-5 job, 5 days a week. I can tell you I'm much more interested in flying than marketing.
06-28-2012, 08:07 AM
#147
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Joined APC: Jul 2010
Position: 7er
Posts: 1,673
Originally Posted by skylover
We figured $750 for rent, $150 for utilities & car insurance, $200 for food, $50 for gas, $150 for cable/internet/cell phone, total $1300. Obviously way underestimated I guess.
The only other career path I've ever considered is marketing/brand management. But I have a hard time stomaching a 9-5 job, 5 days a week. I can tell you I'm much more interested in flying than marketing.
The only other career path I've ever considered is marketing/brand management. But I have a hard time stomaching a 9-5 job, 5 days a week. I can tell you I'm much more interested in flying than marketing.
06-28-2012, 08:44 AM
#148
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Joined APC: May 2010
Position: CFI
Posts: 413
Originally Posted by chrisreedrules
get real... you can't be serious?? 25K is peanuts with the cost of living today. After taxes etc you are left with about 21K... Thats about $1750 p/month.
Cheap rent in a "questionable" area of town = $700 p/month
Utilities if you are really "roughin it" = $75 p/month
Gas for you vehicle = $100 p/month
Food = $300 p/month
Insurance(s) = $100 to $250 p/month
Keeping your gf happy (or going out with friends) = $150 p/month
Thats around $1500 p/month for basic living expenses. What if your car breaks? What if you fall down and break your wrist? What if you get in a car accident? How do you start saving for retirement? Do you have any sort of personal hobby that costs a bit of $$$? All those things add up too.
I'm not sure who helped you make your budget but they might have been "letting you down easy". 25K is barely livable these days. I won't be too hard on you because your just a kid, but seriously... you have absolutely no clue about the world yet. Be worried about chasing girls, not a dream of aviation. Wait a couple years and if the industry hasn't totally tanked again then maybe consider it.
Cheap rent in a "questionable" area of town = $700 p/month
Utilities if you are really "roughin it" = $75 p/month
Gas for you vehicle = $100 p/month
Food = $300 p/month
Insurance(s) = $100 to $250 p/month
Keeping your gf happy (or going out with friends) = $150 p/month
Thats around $1500 p/month for basic living expenses. What if your car breaks? What if you fall down and break your wrist? What if you get in a car accident? How do you start saving for retirement? Do you have any sort of personal hobby that costs a bit of $$$? All those things add up too.
I'm not sure who helped you make your budget but they might have been "letting you down easy". 25K is barely livable these days. I won't be too hard on you because your just a kid, but seriously... you have absolutely no clue about the world yet. Be worried about chasing girls, not a dream of aviation. Wait a couple years and if the industry hasn't totally tanked again then maybe consider it.
06-28-2012, 09:15 AM
#149
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Joined APC: Sep 2009
Position: Left seat of a Jet
Posts: 514
Originally Posted by skylover
I understand. Obviously my budget must have been a little underestimated, because on paper it didn't look as bad as what you're describing.
How are regional airlines going to get new-hires then if they continue to pay such low salaries, especially with the increased attrition in the coming years? They must increase pay to attract new pilots, right?
How are regional airlines going to get new-hires then if they continue to pay such low salaries, especially with the increased attrition in the coming years? They must increase pay to attract new pilots, right?
A better question is why are you concern? Unless you have some sort of stake in a company or a business surviving why care. If one door or many doors close other doors will open!
06-28-2012, 10:39 AM
#150
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Joined APC: May 2012
Posts: 192
Originally Posted by bozobigtop
A better question is why are you concern? Unless you have some sort of stake in a company or a business surviving why care. If one door or many doors close other doors will open!
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