Originally Posted by airgoose

I have been silent reader here lately, thinking about applying now asap.

would really appreciate if someone can give me more info about WGA please.

Fleet difference? B747/MD11

Upgrade times? B747/MD11

Pros and cons? B747/MD11

For those current pilots, if given chance what would you have choose and why?

Training success ratio on 747 or MD11

Does the new atlas pay, WGA less attractive?

Can we also expect more pay increase? Or at-least Business class on DH’s?




Thank you everyone

Originally Posted by Cujo665

Salty, but accurate... with the exception of calling it a supplemental exception to 117. It's not that it's supplemental; it that it's cargo. There are plenty of supplemental passenger operators, and they're under 117.

Originally Posted by treefiddy

MD11 - More block hours, great crews, 2 sometimes broken courier seats for "rest facilities", probably more AOG sitting even with the additional block hours, but adding a few new airframes by the end of 2022.
747 - Some would say it has more of a "Gucci" vibe being the smaller fleet but I would say this depends on the crews you fly with over there as well. Facilities onboard compared to the MD are obviously night and day. Most trips are similar to MD but there are a few different ones.
777 - They are coming. Announcement was for (2) 777-200LRF, with the option for one more and the right to purchase 2 additional ones. Deliveries start in August 2024 so take that into consideration as well.

I would say you can't go wrong on either fleet right now. Just depends on what you want. If you come prepared training is typical for ACMI. No AQP. In the past, upgrade was dependent on captain/instructor recommendations, performance and not seniority. The book says you need 500 hours of WGA time to be considered. This system may go away with the union coming though. The problem is even if they go in seniority they can't find enough people to pass upgrade class. Attrition is high right now, so that will continue to create quick opportunities for upgrade. The pay needs to increase more, but timing will be dependent on contract negotiations.

Disclaimer - I bailed for UPS but it was a great job.

Originally Posted by airgoose

Thank you so the insight, totally makes sense.

Would you be able to give me insights on training? You did mention about captain upgrades, are those really hard that very few people pass?

Originally Posted by Cujo665

use the link on the profile page itself to send in an update

Originally Posted by treefiddy

It's not "hard" in the sense that it's beyond what you would expect for upgrade training. We have a lot of people I think that would rather be lifer FOs that don't show up prepared when given the opportunity. I can say for sure our instructors on the MD11 are the best in the business and are always willing to help you be successful if you put in the effort. The same could be said for initial. It's challenging especially if you are coming from an AQP program. Oral exams cover the entire panel and its 2-3 hours on average. The PC is your standard type rating checkride. I think most people that have issues with the flying portion is mostly in learning the FMS, and the FCP panel and how to deal with "PROF" mode if you have never used it before. It's different than a typical Boeing cockpit setup but not hard to learn.

Originally Posted by 80Z28Dude

Other benefits include. a $30000 retention bonus every three years and consistent, but not guaranteed, peak season bonuses. We’ve received bonuses in 5 of the last 6 years. Employee Stock Ownership Plan has huge potential. It costs you nothing. With current conditions, upgrade could come in far less than 2 years. If you do well in training, 1 year is not out of the question. We get a lot of good guys, but they leave for UPS, Fedex, United, shortly after they arrive. FO pay is less than other ACMIs. First year is comparable. But a quick upgrade to Captain could factor in making a decision. Pay raise is likely in the near future. ALPA has been voted in, but they’ve accomplished nothing so far, except collect dues. If don’t want to pay dues, you don’t have to join until a CBA is in place. That could take 5 years.

Originally Posted by JohnBurke

The link I cited to the ECFR is to 14 CFR 121 Subpart S: Flight Time Limitations, Supplemental Operations.

Your operation (NOT WGA, to be clear) utilizes Operations Specification (OpSpec) A117 to operate under 14 CFR 117.

While you (NOT WGA) are a supplemental carrier, you do not operate under Subpart S, the flight, duty, and rest limitations applicable to Supplemental Operations, because you have been issued OpSpec A117, which authorizes the use of alternate rest, duty, and flight time limitations, with onboard rest facilities. Without that OpSpec, you would be beholden to Subpart S.

WGA does is not authorized OpSpec 117; their MD11 and does not have rest facilities or do on board rest, that airplane makes up the bulk of its fleet.

You are correct, however, that the supplemental cargo segment of the industry was "carved out" of the modernization of rest requirements as now detailed in Part 117. The air cargo industry lobbied to ensure that cargo was kept in the dark ages, so far as rest, duty, and flight time requirements.

Originally Posted by Kansaspilot92

I’ve tried as well as others.

Originally Posted by airgoose

This makes sense, It would be great if WGA also provided Business Class seats on DH's Greater than 3 to 4 hrs. (Just like another airline does ex: Atlas air)
Thank you for more information, I did not know this at all.