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Old 12-30-2007, 01:32 PM   #1  
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Default B757 Program

I would like to talk about the B757 program. It is an exceptional program. The pilot that goes through the program will be pleased with it.

The flex/LCA group that was selected for the program was done in two phases. The first phase of selectees designed the program. The second phase of selectees went through the program as students with the 1st phase of flex/LCAs instructing. The FAA watched this entire process and signed off the program.

The intent of the two groups of flex/LCAs was to design a program, go through the entire program with the FAA overseeing the process. This group of individuals were told that they would be doing this job for two years. The most important function in this process was to train and have oversight of our replacements during this two year time frame. We would then go to another aircraft (that we could hold) or return to our previous aircraft. This was a busy process with little time for anything else.

This group of instructors understood there was a problem with the CBA concerning the introduction of a narrow body aircraft to our company. We were told this was being worked on by the company and the union leadership. Yes, this was an adult to adult agreement. With the abililty to monday night quarterback today, we should have had the issue resolved before starting this process i.e approached the union leadership - our representatives in this process.

Upon return to memphis, it was discovered that this process was not being worked on. In fact, I talked with a union rep at AOC to see how it was going and he said it was not being worked on. He stated that they had known about it for weeks and had a solution to it. This was a suprise. The union leadership was approached for gudiance.

At no time were special pay packages being worked on by any instructor. We thought our situation was being dealt with.

Lessons learned:

1. CBA is the defining document - if it is not covered then get it in writing from a process by the union and the company - CBA didn't cover situation like this
2. B777 -FDX ALPA standards and training should be working with the company during a conversion - using ALPA's expertise with safety, training and standardization
3. Flex/LCA block rep should be involved
4. Union leadership should get involved with 2 and 3 above

Lastly, there have been numerous misstatements about what occurred during the initial onset of the B757 to our company. Some of them are not true. The company and union leadership could have approached this from a far different perspective. As a flex/LCA group we were at fault for not having the flex/LCA issue relsolved from day one. With the aforementioned said, the only loser in this sad but true process is SAFETY!
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Old 12-30-2007, 01:42 PM   #2  
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Very good post. Personally, I hope that the company and union get their collective houses in order and send us an LOA which will promote Safety as well as highly experienced, and well compensated instructors to implement this conversion. It is sad that both the company and the union did not solve this problem at the onset.
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Old 12-30-2007, 02:13 PM   #3  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FDXBUCK View Post
I would like to talk about the B757 program. It is an exceptional program. The pilot that goes through the program will be pleased with it.

The flex/LCA group that was selected for the program was done in two phases. The first phase of selectees designed the program. The second phase of selectees went through the program as students with the 1st phase of flex/LCAs instructing. The FAA watched this entire process and signed off the program.

The intent of the two groups of flex/LCAs was to design a program, go through the entire program with the FAA overseeing the process. This group of individuals were told that they would be doing this job for two years. The most important function in this process was to train and have oversight of our replacements during this two year time frame. We would then go to another aircraft (that we could hold) or return to our previous aircraft. This was a busy process with little time for anything else.

This group of instructors understood there was a problem with the CBA concerning the introduction of a narrow body aircraft to our company. We were told this was being worked on by the company and the union leadership. Yes, this was an adult to adult agreement. With the abililty to monday night quarterback today, we should have had the issue resolved before starting this process i.e approached the union leadership - our representatives in this process.

Upon return to memphis, it was discovered that this process was not being worked on. In fact, I talked with a union rep at AOC to see how it was going and he said it was not being worked on. He stated that they had known about it for weeks and had a solution to it. This was a suprise. The union leadership was approached for gudiance.

At no time were special pay packages being worked on by any instructor. We thought our situation was being dealt with.

Lessons learned:

1. CBA is the defining document - if it is not covered then get it in writing from a process by the union and the company - CBA didn't cover situation like this
2. B777 -FDX ALPA standards and training should be working with the company during a conversion - using ALPA's expertise with safety, training and standardization
3. Flex/LCA block rep should be involved
4. Union leadership should get involved with 2 and 3 above

Lastly, there have been numerous misstatements about what occurred during the initial onset of the B757 to our company. Some of them are not true. The company and union leadership could have approached this from a far different perspective. As a flex/LCA group we were at fault for not having the flex/LCA issue relsolved from day one. With the aforementioned said, the only loser in this sad but true process is SAFETY!
Do they issue Depends in groundschool for all the age 60 guys?
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Old 12-30-2007, 02:19 PM   #4  
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The real magic act will be when they reopen the 757 bid to allow the lca/flex guys to bid it, they will have to outbid the over 60 guys. Should be interesting.
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Old 12-30-2007, 02:44 PM   #5  
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I suspect that most of us can guess who FDXBUCK (757 program) might be? I admire your sticking your nose in this hornets nest while almost using your real name.

I like that you NOW recognize that the union should have been involved from the start and that we need to get this stuff in writing BEFORE we "take managements word" in the future (or the past for that matter). Your posting is well thought out and well presented. So ... what now?

Although I agree that it "could" be a safety issue, I've seen little at FedEx that's driven by safety (I've received safety training from the military, ALPA and the NTSB!).

You're obviously much closer to this problem than I am ... I don't see an easy solution for this problem. Lots of good lessons learned here. It's in all of our interests to find a GOOD solution ...

Happy New Year to all you APC folks.

Now back to football ...

Mark
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Old 12-30-2007, 02:58 PM   #6  
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Thanks for sharing your post with us.

Have a healthy and happy New Year.
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Old 12-30-2007, 03:00 PM   #7  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaydayMark View Post
I suspect that most of us can guess who FDXBUCK (757 program) might be? I admire your sticking your nose in this hornets nest while almost using your real name.


Mark
Gutsiest move I've ever seen Mav.

Amazing what can be see from below now huh?
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Old 12-30-2007, 03:38 PM   #8  
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John Grones needs to be on every flex guys speed dial. While I didn't like some of the comments he made on the ALPA site about the LOA, I think he will help you guys look for a solution. He is your rep and he works for you. I'm sure with all the chaos of the last few months he is ready to listen and work with you guys and take your ideas up the chain.

Some of my favorite captains got caught up in this fiasco. I hope this can be worked out and we can get the right guys into the job.

I got a call from a guy who didn't appreciate the tone of the Message Line implying that the flex guys were independent contractors, and your post indicates you feel the same way. I don't think there was a conspiracy on either side of this issue--just some comm breakdowns.

Nice move coming out and stirring the pot. Good luck to you too.
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Old 12-30-2007, 03:48 PM   #9  
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From my point of view, individual Flex/LCA's were approached to participate in the program and agreed to step up to the plate and help the company (after all, we are the company). They wanted assurances and pay protection, and were told that it was being worked. It may or may not have been.

What I don't get is why are we giving FDX ALPA a pass on this one? They knew that this was being done and were not proactive about approaching the company to get this resolved. If the compnay offers a 10k deposit assistance to the FDA pilots, they'll intervene - so why not when the company is working outside of the CBA to start a training dept? Was it really the job of the individual flexes to say no when they were asked to get this program started? DW's e-mail made it sound like these guys were all free agents trying to stick it to the rest of us, when in reality they were stepping up to the plate to get this program started from the ground up and trusting that mgt and the union were actually doing their jobs, imagine that.
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Old 12-30-2007, 03:53 PM   #10  
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John has alway's been a stand up guy for his flock. Very knowledgeable and stands up to either side when they are on the wrong side of an issue.
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