No need to prattle on about inconsequential increments. There are these easy universal rules to make life simple. And be sure to have more than a passing knowledge of any weapon you may reasonably pick up in the AO.


Rules for a Gunfight
Anonymous-Attributed to a Marine
1. Bring a gun. Preferably, bring at least two guns. Bring all of your friends who have guns.

2. Anything worth shooting is worth shooting twice. Ammo is cheap - life is expensive.

3. Only hits count. The only thing worse than a miss is a slow miss.

4. If your shooting stance is good, you're probably not moving fast enough or using cover correctly.

5. Move away from your attacker. Distance is your friend. (Lateral and diagonal movement are preferred.)

6. If you can choose what to bring to a gunfight, bring a long gun and a friend with a long gun.

7. In ten years nobody will remember the details of caliber, stance, or tactics. They will only remember who lived.

8. If you are not shooting, you should be communicating, reloading, and running.

9. Accuracy is relative: most combat shooting standards will be more dependent on "pucker factor" than the inherent accuracy of the gun. Use a gun that works EVERY TIME. "All skill is in vain when an Angel blows the powder from the flintlock of your musket."

10. Someday someone may kill you with your own gun, but they should have to beat you to death with it because it is empty.

11. Always cheat, always win. The only unfair fight is the one you lose.

12. Have a plan.

13. Have a back-up plan, because the first one won't work.

14. Use cover or concealment as much as possible.

15. Flank your adversary when possible. Protect yours.

16. Don't drop your guard.

17. Always tactical load and threat scan 360 degrees.

18. Watch their hands. Hands kill. (In God we trust. Everyone else, keep your hands where I can see them.)

19. Decide to be aggressive ENOUGH, quickly ENOUGH.

20. The faster you finish the fight, the less shot you will get.

21. Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet.

22. Be courteous to everyone, friendly to no one.

23. Your number one option for personal security is a lifelong commitment to avoidance, deterrence, and de-escalation.

24. Do not attend a gun fight with a handgun, the caliber of which does not start with anything smaller than "4".

25. You can't miss fast enough to win.


And broken down by service:

Navy SEALS Rules For Gunfights

Look very cool in sunglasses.
Kill every living thing within view.
Return quickly to looking cool in latest beach wear.
Check hair in mirror.

US Army Rangers Rules For Gunfights

Walk in 50 miles wearing 75 pound ruck while starving.
Locate individuals requiring killing.
Request permission via radio from �Higher� to perform killing.
Curse bitterly when mission is aborted.
Walk out 50 miles wearing a 75 pound ruck while starving.


Army Rules For Gunfights

Select a new beret to wear
Sew combat patch on right shoulder
Change the color of beret you decide to wear


US Air Force Rules For Gunfights

Have a cocktail
Adjust temperature on air-conditioner
See what�s on HBO
Determine �what is a gunfight�
Request more funding from Congress with a �killer� Power Point presentation
Wine & dine �key� Congressmen, invite DoD & defense industry executives
Receive funding, set up new command and assemble assets
Declare the assets �strategic� and never deploy them operationally
Tell the Navy to send the Marines


US Navy Rules For Gunfights

Go to Sea
Drink Coffee
Watch porn
Send the Marines

That first part sounds like something Jeff Cooper would say.

Les Baer's were the last round of issue. It wasn't as if they had loads of problems, but in combat we wanted to most reliable pistol. Which is also why the M4 has been replaced by the HK416.


The 1911's aren't issued in the Army SOF units anymore. Again it's a pretty new thing and most of the guys in the squadrons still have their 1911's, but the Glock is the issued weapon and it's what they carry in the sandbox. The Mk23's have been mostly turned in by the Groups and SEAL teams as it was just too big. It's accurate but commonly referred as the "crew served pistol."

Delta still carries the Wilson Combat 1911s right?
"Crew served pistol" that's pretty funny... good weapon though, its little brother, the USPC .45 Tactical is also nice.

416 - great weapon.... about time for the gas piston to come back

CAG, ie Delta no longer carry the 1911.

Most guys who used the Mk23 thought that it would have been much better to use the USPC Tactical

Sorry about that I just saw it on one of your previous posts. Do they still use MP5s, last I heard they were trying out the MP7?

They still have MP5s but aren't used very much. The R&D section tries out about everything out there (MP7, Knight's PDW, HK 417, FN SCAR, 6.5 Grendel, etc, etc...)

The Glock deal is the same as Law enforcement price for up to two guns. I got the deal right from my local dealer. I just went in and requested the Law enforcement deal. They can call glock directly if they say you can't have it.

Also has anyone tried to order from other manufacturers? I want a walther....I tried SIG but they will only give the discount if you are a FFDO.

Thanks for the advice on the mags.

I use several...
Hornady 155gr TAP (primary load)
Gold Dot 180gr
Federal HST 165gr
Gold Saber 165gr

Bring it back from the dead, but:

How long did it take for the gun to show up after H&K charged your credit card?

I've read several places that the 165's are just about optimal in the .40