brocklee9000

But if they can get a normal job at home, they could break even. I’m not saying it’s a guarantee, but just theoretically. Let’s say you get 4 four day trips in a month, each 80 hours time away from base. That’s 320 TAFB, and let’s say your trips either more or less totaled monthly guarantee or they added some reserve days to equal 75. Okay, 75*$38= $2850. You’re gone 16-18 days, commuting, crash pad, food, etc. Assuming you could get 18-19 hours out of that 80 hour TAFB, that works out to getting paid less than 25% of the time you’re in duty that 4 day trip, which ends up being like $9 per hour for that 80 hr footprint.

Now again, hypothetically you find a job at home. Work 8 hours a day at $15/hr. If you can do that 5 days a week, that’s 160 hours x $15/hr, giving you $2400. But you’re home every day, not commuting, not on reserve, not the most junior guy, etc. If you’re home based, you spend literally twice as much time not working (160 vs 320). And you’d be away from home at an even higher ratio if you had to commute. You make a few hundred less in this situation, but how much are you paying to park, buy food, crash pad/hotel, plus the non-monetary cost of being gone more.

Again, purely hypothetical but I can see why it would be much more appealing to stay home and try to get another job in the meantime. Especially with some budgeting, money in the bank, and a spouse that can work as well. Probably more likely to get hired into a simpler job like that immediately and start bringing home some sort of paycheck too. If he went the Commutair route, there’s all the time of applying, interviewing, indoc, training, IOE. Maybe he gets lucky and can get a better office type job. But even if he has a degree in finance or business or whatever, I have to imagine a company would hire someone with work experience versus a furloughed main line pilot who probably got an Econ degree 5-10 years ago and has never used it.

climb150

You keep referencing it so you post it. Actually I just did and can't be bothered wading through 26 LOAs to find what on earth it is you keep referencing.

rickair7777

This is a point. Subsidizing your commute and dealing with the pain of regional reserve juniority is a part of dues paying which people put up with as a means to an end.

But I still recall more than a few J4J takers the last couple times. Maybe for the benefits, maybe just because that's what they know how to do. Also if they think they're going to be out for a loooong time, they may want stay current and even build time to open up other avenues in aviation.

Hobbit64

yep. he’s sort of a professional sh!t stirrer in the regional forums.
kinda sad when viewed at a distance.
he’s that 20 year old at the high school prom, picking fights.

StickPig

Since being at mainline made you lazy and unable to cite a reference, I guess I will.

https://crewroom.alpa.org/ual/Deskto...cumentID=43832

LOA 11, document page 387.

For the record, you’re not providing an “education,” and I guess that’s cool that up there in the promised land where you mainline guys reside there are protections like this. But things like this are exactly why I don’t care for ALPA. We all exist to protect mainline. However, I do agree with one thing you said; a branded carrier should do all of their own flying. Express carriers shouldn’t exist at all.

rickair7777

The wording of the LOA doesn't matter that much. If ALPA pressures UAL to help the furloughs, then UAL will hold UAX to contractual provisions or pressure them, either way. That doesn't cost UAL anything, but not doing it could create a lot of hard feelings... which they'll be stuck with for decades.

Cutscene: July 8th, 2048:
FO: Shut down the APU now? That memo said they want to save biofuel at the gate?
CA: Naw, let 'er burn. When I got furloughed back in '21 those *%*&@(%^! had the commuters flying my routes and wouldn't even arrange for them to hire me.

It will not be in UAX's best interest to resist that kind of pressure, and hiring UAL furloughs doesn't cost them much. Furloughs will probably be out for a while, and when they leave C5 they'll be getting to about that seniority where regionals prefer their CA's to move on anyway.

itsmytime

careful what you wish for, your carrier could be next, and if you think you’re going over to mainline with the flying, I’ve got a bridge to sell you.

StickPig

I don’t think anyone is going to mainline for quite some time. I’m simply saying the FFD model should have never existed. It’s a way to contract cheap labor and that’s it.

point80

Im glad that C5 got to stay employeed and kept by UA. Its one less group of pilots that will lose their jobs this year. But honestly this thread is dumb unless C5 changes its business model to either 550s or 175s.

SK has made himself pretty clear that in the long run he only wants luxury 50 seaters (550s). He has stuck to his guns while regional pilots have been delusional to the idea. The 145s and 200s will be obsolete over the next couple years. The reason you just cant get rid of them tomorrow is bc of scope, not contracts. There isnt enough 550s on the line to cover what would be needed based on scope limiting 76/70 seaters on a six month look back.

The assumption that C5 will inherit all of XJTs flying is pretty hilarious. They will get a cut, like everyone else. Most of XJTs flying was in ORD and IAH. Two bases that C5 is not even in. The UA flying in IAH that belonged to XJT is already starting to be divided up between YV and OO.

Your pilot group was staffed to do 10k flight hours. During this pandemic C5 has been doing closer to 2-3k Even with your cut of xjt flying you will not break 8k. And as more 550s are made available they will eat into the 145s flying.

So how about we pump the breaks on the idea of expanding 145s. Especially as we start to role into a recession that will take years to recover from.

rickair7777

Little problem with 550's... there's no certain future of new production.

Currently planned 550's are retrofits of used airframes. Bombardier sold the CRJ to MHI. MHI is supposed to complete production on any outstanding orders but has no obligation or apparent intent to continue building new CRJs of any sort. MHI bought the CRJ not because they wanted to build it or have anything to do with it... they bought it to get the global support network and customer base which they hope will enable the success of the MRJ (or spicejet or whatever they call it now).

550's should be considered a temporary measure. UAL either hopes to wipe out scope in BK, or maybe hopes that 175s or spicejets can be converted to comply with 50 seat scope. No clear way ahead on any of that.