Compass updates
10-12-2014 | 06:37 AM
#4721
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 379
Likes: 0
From: Satisfied
30 hour layovers are generally in less desirable stations. SDF, IAH, YXE, etc. The good news is there are far less of them next month (for MSP at least). All of our hotels are airport hotels. We have a provision for downtown hotels but it will never happen with TSH at the helm.
10-12-2014 | 06:47 AM
#4722
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 593
Likes: 0
I cringe just a little bit every time i hear this rationalization. it simply isnt true because the company would never have built a pairing like this without the ADTG. I remember when i started there were some EXTREMELY inefficient pairings because we were not getting min day on the 30 hour layover and now there is a minimum value that has to be paid; the 9 hour three day will never happen again. In that sense, the ADTG has helped.
Now, do i wish the pairings were more efficient? OF COURSE! And personally, i think it seems to be trending that way. The company can either staff thin or make our pairings inefficient, not both and it seems to me that the number of 30 hour overnights is decreasing in comparison to when the ADTG was first implemented.
Now, do i wish the pairings were more efficient? OF COURSE! And personally, i think it seems to be trending that way. The company can either staff thin or make our pairings inefficient, not both and it seems to me that the number of 30 hour overnights is decreasing in comparison to when the ADTG was first implemented.
10-12-2014 | 07:02 AM
#4723
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 3,045
Likes: 1
From: FO
They will always optimize the pairings to benefit themselves. No matter what we negotiate, they will optimize the pairings to be as cost effective as possible with in the rules. It is just responsible business management.
10-12-2014 | 07:07 AM
#4724
Line Holder
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 1,272
Likes: 0
From: The Parlor
In talking to an ALPA P2P advisor a majority of the pilot group is unhappy with the ADTG, it is benefiting very few (benefiting junior line holders or those with low credit trips)...the trips are fluctuating because of the decrease in block hours going into low travel season. In talking to the same advisor the company has deliberately changed the pairings to benefit themselves, the advisor stated that when the 6 month ADTG trial period expires they fully expect to not renew it it...for the month of September I lost 9 hours of pay over 3 four day trips. That would have given my roughly $300 extra dollars and 2 days off if the 4 hour min day credit was applied and counted towards PBS, even if it didn't $300 is $300
10-12-2014 | 07:24 AM
#4725
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 593
Likes: 0
You're confusing the new trips with ADTG and forgetting the fact that we now have LAX as a pilot base and no LGA flying. The draw down of LAX pairings out of MSP and no LGA is leading to the crappy pairings. Just a coincidence that it happened at the same time. No more 28 hour 4 days because of the DFW-LGA shuttle and no highly productive west coast shuttle flying. Those were the primary drivers of such high credit trips. Not saying the ADTG is perfect but you need to understand what is really causing the problem.
10-12-2014 | 07:30 AM
#4726
Line Holder
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 1,272
Likes: 0
From: The Parlor
Your confusing that this is directly from the head of the P2P program, this is what the union is saying...concerning this issue. It hasn't benefited me but I'm just one person. In the unions eyes, a majority of the pilot group as a whole is not benefiting from this, you can disagree with me which is fine, but if you believe that what I'm saying isn't true, I suggest you contact your block rep or the P2P chair...I understand you believe things are changing but I've worked at three seperate airlines, the company is always three steps ahead of us as a pilot group, they will find ways to squeeze every cent out of us...they will always find a way
10-12-2014 | 07:39 AM
#4727
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 906
Likes: 0
From: Just another RJ guy
30 hour layovers are generally in less desirable stations. SDF, IAH, YXE, etc. The good news is there are far less of them next month (for MSP at least). All of our hotels are airport hotels. We have a provision for downtown hotels but it will never happen with TSH at the helm.
10-12-2014 | 07:47 AM
#4728
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 906
Likes: 0
From: Just another RJ guy
You're confusing the new trips with ADTG and forgetting the fact that we now have LAX as a pilot base and no LGA flying. The draw down of LAX pairings out of MSP and no LGA is leading to the crappy pairings. Just a coincidence that it happened at the same time. No more 28 hour 4 days because of the DFW-LGA shuttle and no highly productive west coast shuttle flying. Those were the primary drivers of such high credit trips. Not saying the ADTG is perfect but you need to understand what is really causing the problem.
10-12-2014 | 08:21 AM
#4729
Line Holder
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 1,272
Likes: 0
From: The Parlor
Sounds like a lot of speculation, assumption, and coincidences. I don't think the airline runs like that. I think they know exactly what will make them the most money and they will take full advantage of the ADTG deal. They absolutely will, and have, modify the pairings. And if that means more 19 hour 4 days with a 30 hour in the middle then that's what they'll do. I haven't talked to anyone who likes this stupid ADTG deal. If you do then you're in the minority and I hope the union stands up and refuses to renew it after the trial period ends.
10-12-2014 | 09:09 AM
#4730
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 379
Likes: 0
From: Satisfied
Sounds like a lot of speculation, assumption, and coincidences. I don't think the airline runs like that. I think they know exactly what will make them the most money and they will take full advantage of the ADTG deal. They absolutely will, and have, modify the pairings. And if that means more 19 hour 4 days with a 30 hour in the middle then that's what they'll do. I haven't talked to anyone who likes this stupid ADTG deal. If you do then you're in the minority and I hope the union stands up and refuses to renew it after the trial period ends.
For the record, I am not thrilled about the ADTG but I do recognize it as being better than the old system of no min day pay and no credit. My question is - even if we do get pay and credit for 30 hr overnights when this is revisited, how do we know they wont do the same thing and just reconstruct the pairings so they pay as little as possible again so 4 hours min day x 4 days = 16 hr four days?
I dont have the LOA handy so excuse me if I am mistaken and that example I gave is actually not possible.
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