C Series Info
01-26-2018, 01:04 PM
#2034
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: Light Chop
Posts: 23,286
Originally Posted by Mesabah
Airbus gets a free plane, and doesn't have to open a second line in Alabama. Talk about a double win for them.
01-26-2018, 01:04 PM
#2035
Line Holder
Joined APC: Mar 2015
Posts: 73
All today shows is that Boeing didn't suffer any financial harm from losing the sale. It still states that subsidies were involved with the sale.
Basically the Canadian government is subsidizing Delta's aircraft purchase and US passenger travel. This was what everyone predicted last summer when this process started.
IMHO, Boeing will file another complaint over the next C series sale and I'm sure they will be able to show financial harm over that one. They will prepare their offer, etc to ensure they can show financial harm somehow.
Hopefully by then, the Alabama plant will be open.
Basically the Canadian government is subsidizing Delta's aircraft purchase and US passenger travel. This was what everyone predicted last summer when this process started.
IMHO, Boeing will file another complaint over the next C series sale and I'm sure they will be able to show financial harm over that one. They will prepare their offer, etc to ensure they can show financial harm somehow.
Hopefully by then, the Alabama plant will be open.
01-26-2018, 01:11 PM
#2036
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: Light Chop
Posts: 23,286
A good synopsis of the system
And a great synopsis of Delta's position:
In an anti-dumping case, the USITC and the U.S. Department of Commerce each address a different question. Commerce determines whether the alleged dumping or subsidizing is happening and if so, the margin of dumping or amount of subsidy. The USITC determines whether the U.S. industry is materially injured or threatened with material injury by reason of the imports under investigation. If BOTH Commerce and the USITC reach affirmative final determinations on their individual questions, then Commerce will issue an antidumping duty order to offset the dumping or a countervailing duty order to offset the subsidy.
Here, Commerce and USITC did not agree, so no duties/tariffs. The USITC decision could be reviewed by a Court but would be done under an "abuse of discretion" standard. For the non-lawyers, that is a tough standard to meet, but it will depend on the USITC written decision and rationale. Someone else asked if the President can overrule this. No. The President has no role in this, unlike the solar panel dispute which was brought under a different section of US trade law.
Here, Commerce and USITC did not agree, so no duties/tariffs. The USITC decision could be reviewed by a Court but would be done under an "abuse of discretion" standard. For the non-lawyers, that is a tough standard to meet, but it will depend on the USITC written decision and rationale. Someone else asked if the President can overrule this. No. The President has no role in this, unlike the solar panel dispute which was brought under a different section of US trade law.
Government-assisted airlines that are competitors - bad!
Government-assisted airlines that are partners - good!
Government-assisted aircraft manufacturers that give you a great deal - fantastic!
Government-assisted airlines that are partners - good!
Government-assisted aircraft manufacturers that give you a great deal - fantastic!
01-26-2018, 01:28 PM
#2038
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2015
Posts: 4,116
Originally Posted by flyboy2181
All today shows is that Boeing didn't suffer any financial harm from losing the sale. It still states that subsidies were involved with the sale.
Basically the Canadian government is subsidizing Delta's aircraft purchase and US passenger travel. This was what everyone predicted last summer when this process started.
IMHO, Boeing will file another complaint over the next C series sale and I'm sure they will be able to show financial harm over that one. They will prepare their offer, etc to ensure they can show financial harm somehow.
Hopefully by then, the Alabama plant will be open.
Basically the Canadian government is subsidizing Delta's aircraft purchase and US passenger travel. This was what everyone predicted last summer when this process started.
IMHO, Boeing will file another complaint over the next C series sale and I'm sure they will be able to show financial harm over that one. They will prepare their offer, etc to ensure they can show financial harm somehow.
Hopefully by then, the Alabama plant will be open.
Could be seller of record on any future orders is ab.
01-26-2018, 01:43 PM
#2040
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2012
Position: Supreme Allied Commander
Posts: 1,055
You can be government assisted all day long. You just cant under open skies treaties. Hence our issue with the ME3 and not the Chinese.
And the C series wasn't price dumped. It gave a huge launch customer discount, which is customary. They needed to give discounts to offset the risk costs for Delta. It would be dumping if the Quebec government was subsidizing Bombardier in undercutting a Boeing product. It has been clearly proven that the 737 wasn't a competing product, because Boeing THEMSELVES didn't even offer to sell it when Delta put out their RFP.
And the C series wasn't price dumped. It gave a huge launch customer discount, which is customary. They needed to give discounts to offset the risk costs for Delta. It would be dumping if the Quebec government was subsidizing Bombardier in undercutting a Boeing product. It has been clearly proven that the 737 wasn't a competing product, because Boeing THEMSELVES didn't even offer to sell it when Delta put out their RFP.
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