Originally Posted by LeineLodge

Multiple income streams? Great! Use your excess DC to fund investments that produce them - in your own name, under your control. It could be as simple as a dividend producing index fund in a brokerage account. You don’t have to go all crazy and become a slumlord.

But for sure, find one that gets a good return for $ invested. IMO annuities do not qualify.

Pensions fall even lower on the scale of places I want “my” money (it’s not yours, but you already learned that lesson once). Whatever it is, it’s always better to have it under your control and not a promise from Delta.

My point was not to restart this conversation, since we all know where we stand. The point is the MEC keeps asking the same question which means they must not be getting the answer they want to support Bartells’ land grab. They’ll keep asking apparently until they find a way to justify it, which others on this thread have rightly pointed out will likely result in a drawn out stalemate while more “deadZoners” retire.

Don’t worry though, Jerry will be along soon to tell us all how the ponies and 5 years of full retro are achievable with zero concessions. Cause don’t you know, this MEC is a well oiled machine!?!

Oh, and yes to healthcare improvement. I’d even support some retiree healthcare provisions and that would be less likely to vanish, just so you don’t think I’m an a$$ that doesn’t care about you or other pilots approaching retirement.

Originally Posted by LeineLodge

Multiple income streams? Great! Use your excess DC to fund investments that produce them - in your own name, under your control. It could be as simple as a dividend producing index fund in a brokerage account. You don’t have to go all crazy and become a slumlord.

But for sure, find one that gets a good return for $ invested. IMO annuities do not qualify.

Pensions fall even lower on the scale of places I want “my” money (it’s not yours, but you already learned that lesson once). Whatever it is, it’s always better to have it under your control and not a promise from Delta.



My point was not to restart this conversation, since we all know where we stand. The point is the MEC keeps asking the same question which means they must not be getting the answer they want to support Bartells’ land grab. They’ll keep asking apparently until they find a way to justify it, which others on this thread have rightly pointed out will likely result in a drawn out stalemate while more “deadZoners” retire.

Don’t worry though, Jerry will be along soon to tell us all how the ponies and 5 years of full retro are achievable with zero concessions. Cause don’t you know, this MEC is a well oiled machine!?!

Oh, and yes to healthcare improvement. I’d even support some retiree healthcare provisions and that would be less likely to vanish, just so you don’t think I’m an a$$ that doesn’t care about you or other pilots approaching retirement.

Originally Posted by LeineLodge

Totally agree with this. More tax free (sheltered) money could be found by having the company contribute to IRS max’s into the HSA - this would offset the “high deductible” requirement of these accounts.

For those that don’t opt for the HSA, or can’t due to TriCare, provide a plussed up (similar to DPMA excess) equivalent benefit.

Also, take Per Diem to the IRS max per location and any other tax advantaged angle we can find. With less pilots itemizing due to the new tax setup, in 2018 and beyond, this becomes even more valuable.

Originally Posted by LeineLodge

Multiple income streams? Great! Use your excess DC to fund investments that produce them - in your own name, under your control. It could be as simple as a dividend producing index fund in a brokerage account. You don’t have to go all crazy and become a slumlord.

But for sure, find one that gets a good return for $ invested. IMO annuities do not qualify.

Pensions fall even lower on the scale of places I want “my” money (it’s not yours, but you already learned that lesson once). Whatever it is, it’s always better to have it under your control and not a promise from Delta.

My point was not to restart this conversation, since we all know where we stand. The point is the MEC keeps asking the same question which means they must not be getting the answer they want to support Bartells’ land grab. They’ll keep asking apparently until they find a way to justify it, which others on this thread have rightly pointed out will likely result in a drawn out stalemate while more “deadZoners” retire.

Don’t worry though, Jerry will be along soon to tell us all how the ponies and 5 years of full retro are achievable with zero concessions. Cause don’t you know, this MEC is a well oiled machine!?!

Oh, and yes to healthcare improvement. I’d even support some retiree healthcare provisions and that would be less likely to vanish, just so you don’t think I’m an a$$ that doesn’t care about you or other pilots approaching retirement.

Originally Posted by RonRicco

Based on this survey and the polling questions I participated in, there is ZERO doubt they are pushing for a certain outcome.

After actually being involved in legitimate polling, I can tell you one thing... These guys are going to have their hands full at the table unless they do a lot of follow up polling that narrows the priorities. (Exclusive of the DB/DC issue)

Right now I bet 90 percent of the questions are being answered “extremely important.” When they start having to make a choice at the table of what is, or is not achievable, they are going to need to know what the real priorities of the pilot group are.

Better strap in, cause we are in for a long, long ride if this negotiaion hinges on a DB. Why? It is already a polarizing topic and I am afraid if a DB is part of the “as long as it takes” issue, we will not have the unity that is needed to push forward.

Originally Posted by Baradium

I actually have a couple reasons it could be advantageous to have the money in DB.

First, the increase is likely going to be based on a monetary value, not a percentage. So you aren't going to see a larger increase by having the percentages all in a raise.

Huh? Not understanding this comment. Every raise we have gotten in the past has been a percentage. That is what we are taking about.......is a 5% hourly raise worth more or less than a 5% DC increase? I don’t understand your logic.

Secondly, contract comparison is normally done using the base hourly pay rates.

Just like previous discussions involving the profit sharing advantage going away after one contract cycle once combined into rates, the same thing would happen here. The more places we put money that are not in the base pay rates, the easier it will be to keep the advantage in upcoming contract cycles as other airlines increase their base pay.

Originally Posted by hockeypilot44

Guys on the way out want a pension and guaranteed income at the expense of the rest of the contract (which means at the expense of the younger pilots.) I’ve said it on here before. I put on my survey that I don’t even want touch the retirement section.