S3A
 

SIAP, but talked to a recent retiree and he was really upset about this (change?) that puts Endeavor guys ahead of our retiree's. I wholeheartedly agree. I say we put this high on our list for the contract. Not right.

Agreed. Could I have a medical plan with that please. Medium rare.

You want a retiree to go in front of an actively working employee?
Why do you think they get the retiree designation?

A retiree goes behind the dependent of Endeavor as well as the employee on main line metal which is wrong.

You mean have a pilot who spent an entire career in service to our company go in front of a regional pilot possibly straight out of indoc? Yes I do. And that’s as a former regional pilot.

There could obviously be exceptions for pilots commuting to work, but arguing that a retiree should lose the last Delta One seat to Sydney to an Endeavor new hire is going to be a pretty tough ask here.

One issue I see is, if a retiree bumps an active Endeavor employee while he/she is commuting to work. They get positive space on the next flight. What if that next flight is already over sold or you and your family is trying to non rev on.

That employee does not work for Delta. The retiree did.

Having Uncle John and little Timmy get on a flight prior to an active employee trying to get to work is beyond me..:confused: Active employees should very well go ahead of retirees. They're trying to get to work, to a job, and make a living. If they can't get to work, how is that done? Then if they can't, that causes an operational disruption as crew members are out of place, or positive space tickets are issued. Let's not overthink this..

What if they’re not going to work? What if they’re going on vacation on a 15 hr flight? Should a one-week veteran of Endeavor really bump a guy with 40 plus years at mainline back to steerage? Badflap’s knees might not take it ;)

Well - they don't anymore, and the Endeavor employee does work for Delta. They are not a Delta employee, but make no mistake those pay rates are the reason you and that retiree enjoyed all those profit sharing checks.

You retire, your seperated from the company. As a benefit you still get space available travel, albeit at a lower priority.

Regardless or not, they are a Delta owned company, and active employees should very well go ahead of retirees/others. It's the same way here. We're just lucky we don't do it like American..Then people would really be crying a river.

The Endeavor employee is not a Delta employee. He “works for Delta” in the same way the caterers and fuellers do.

The Delta retiree was an employee at one point.

https://www.memesmonkey.com/images/m...751517622.jpeg

I didn't know Delta owned Gate Gourmet or Menzies, do they also fly the airplane? No?

"At one point" as in, no longer.

What does the paycheck and ID say?

Their ID actually says "Property of DELTA AIR LINES, INC"

Nice try. Just give up.

I'd have to ask my wife about the paycheck as I haven't seen what one looks like in 5 years, but the ID says "Endeavor Air Delta Connection" with a Delta logo on it, the back it says:
Property of Delta Air Lines, INC.|
And gives an address in Atlanta Georgia.

Again, not an employee for Delta. But we are a Delta subsidiary and are still in active service for Delta Air Lines. A retiree is not.

Ok. But what does the front of the ID say?

When they fill out an airline app, do they list “Delta Air Lines” as they’re current employer?

How about their W2?

Tax return?

What they tell chicks at the bar doesn’t cut it.

Someone should definitely give up.

Endeavor uses Delta payroll to save money.

The S3A issue is because Delta was having to bump revenue passengers to give positive space to commuting endeavor crew members.

So y’all really think that Ed Bastian would rather have a retiree going to play golf make it on the airplane while an Endeavor pilot going to work -who is contributing to the continued success of Delta- gets left behind? It seems like Endeavor is treated as “part of DL” when it’s convenient, and treated as very, very separate when it’s not. Does AA allow retirees to go ahead of active wholly-owned employees? I’m asking because I don’t know...

How many "okay, but what abouts" do you have to use to differentiate your own importance from Endeavor?

It's not the Endeavor employee's fault the retiree's peers gave up the scope up allow them to exist in the first place. Maybe it's a little just deserts for them?

So explain to me why a Delta employee is S3 on an ENDEAVOR flight meanwhile an ENDEAVOR employee is also S3. If we want to go with your idea, Delta employees should be below Endeavor employees on their airplanes. What do you think about that? Oh I get it, because those airplanes are owned by DELTA. Is it starting to make a little more sense?

It’s not about self-importance. It’s about accuracy.

I think an employee should have priority on their own metal.

Thank you. I agree. An active employee should have priority.

Case closed.

Technically, a wholly-owned subsidiary is part of the parent company; At least legally. Most companies, no matter their setup, put active employees over their retirees.

On their own metal.

That’s not what he said.

So an employee of a company should go ahead of a retiree?
Therefore a Endeavor employee, who only operates aircraft owned by Delta Air Lines should go ahead of a retiree who is not an active employee?
I think we agree here. It's almost like they came up with a system to put the subsidiary employee ahead of a retiree while maintaining the integrity of all the active employees yet giving the retirees a continued benefit for free.

Every thought about pursuing important things like the outstanding JV scope violations that are actually hurting you?

Their own metal, is Delta's metal. Hate to break the news to you.

Operated by Endeavor. So it’s Endeavor’s metal. And Endeavor employees and retirees should mostly definitely have priority in that case.

If added into your contract, it would only be for retired pilots.

True but mainline is not their metal. Let me ask you this: Should compass, GoJet, Republic, and Skywest all go ahead of our retirees for vacation travel? Or just you guys? Our retirees gave a lot for this profession.

Gave a lot, like scope? Haha. Sorry. I couldn't help myself.

Based on the arguments, yes, they are active employees.

I guess I did set myself up for that :D

Yes they did, which is why Delta still gives them the ability to travel the world for free.

Totally don’t buy the “Endeavor employee NON-REVVING to work” argument. In that case, an Endeavor employee non-revving to WORK should have priority over an S2, right?

The jumpseat is for commuting. Non-reving is a benefit of employment (active or retired). Not eligible for the jumpseat? Then commuting to work at Endeavor is dicey career choice. Got bumped from the jumpseat? Commuter clause.

Endeavor is a wholly owned. They are not Delta employees. Their benefits should not undermine Delta employee benefits (active or retired).

I’m almost convinced this is a false flag move to force us to expend negotiating capital on a benefit we already had.

Signed,
Former ASA Mainline Pilot

Agreed. Why can’t endeavor book jumpseat on delta just like us?

:confused: :confused: :confused:

So only 1-2 people per flight can commute to work? lol