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Jdub2 11-23-2022 09:30 PM


Originally Posted by RunFast (Post 3536818)
Educate me, what is an escalator clause?

something along the lines of, every anniversary past amendable pay rates are adjusted upwards by CPI automatically.

it would drastically limit the leverage the company has and their ability to drag out negotiations.

Starcheck102 11-23-2022 10:14 PM


Originally Posted by notEnuf (Post 3536617)
Two words. Escalator clause. If the environment was ever right, it’s now. Que the TVM and retro arguments. Fix this now and retro and company foot dragging becomes moo. This needs to be done or we are doomed to continue the cycle.

This would work if the numbers were right. What I don’t see is how the company could be compelled to agree to the sort of numbers that anyone would accept.

Two signatures at the bottom of every TA, and neither side is surrendering.

Starcheck102 11-23-2022 10:16 PM


Originally Posted by PilotJ3 (Post 3536733)
There better be…

We need to vote on the Scope TA before the contract.

Because if we lock the contract and don’t like the Scope TA and vote No for that, we are stuck with whatever “gains” we negotiated apart from the Scope TA.

Tell me you don’t read emails from ALPA without telling me you don’t read emails from ALPA.

Big E 757 11-24-2022 01:37 AM


Originally Posted by Starcheck102 (Post 3536838)
This would work if the numbers were right. What I don’t see is how the company could be compelled to agree to the sort of numbers that anyone would accept.

Two signatures at the bottom of every TA, and neither side is surrendering.

I asked a Union guy YEARS ago why we didn’t ask for something like this. His response was that the company would never agree to something like this because we would never be motivated to negotiate when our contract was up. In other words, management would lose the power of the RLA. I doubt we’ve even tried. Now that we are negotiating under a mediator, maybe they’ll ask, but I doubt it.

Scoop 11-24-2022 03:55 AM


Originally Posted by crazyjaydawg (Post 3536807)
With the speed of the scope AIP, IF (huge IF) a PWA AIP is reached by EOY, we probably won’t vote on a TA until Memorial Day!

Memorial day of what year?

Scoop :D

Mooner 11-24-2022 04:20 AM


Originally Posted by Big E 757 (Post 3536852)
I asked a Union guy YEARS ago why we didn’t ask for something like this. His response was that the company would never agree to something like this because we would never be motivated to negotiate when our contract was up. In other words, management would lose the power of the RLA. I doubt we’ve even tried. Now that we are negotiating under a mediator, maybe they’ll ask, but I doubt it.

He told you true. They love the railway labor act and love the results. So would any of us if we were in their shoes.

Vsop 11-24-2022 04:56 AM


Originally Posted by Big E 757 (Post 3536852)
I asked a Union guy YEARS ago why we didn’t ask for something like this. His response was that the company would never agree to something like this because we would never be motivated to negotiate when our contract was up. In other words, management would lose the power of the RLA. I doubt we’ve even tried. Now that we are negotiating under a mediator, maybe they’ll ask, but I doubt it.

That’s funny. I asked a union guy years ago too at a different company. I got the exact same answer. It makes me wonder if it’s ever been asked for. I think it’s achievable if we make it a priority.

chrisreedrules 11-24-2022 05:06 AM


Originally Posted by Vsop (Post 3536894)
That’s funny. I asked a union guy years ago too at a different company. I got the exact same answer. It makes me wonder if it’s ever been asked for. I think it’s achievable if we make it a priority.

This industry is cyclical. Why would any management team negotiate downward wage pressure during a downturn?

Maybe we could negotiate annual 4% raises for the next 20 years in exchange for no big pay bump up front and no retro. But how many of our pilots are 55+ and would scoff at that idea? And who’s doing the negotiating for legacy pilots? Is it junior guys with quality of life on their mind or is it senior guys with money on their mind? We all know the answer.

Myfingershurt 11-24-2022 06:47 AM


Originally Posted by chrisreedrules (Post 3536899)
This industry is cyclical. Why would any management team negotiate downward wage pressure during a downturn?

Maybe we could negotiate annual 4% raises for the next 20 years in exchange for no big pay bump up front and no retro. But how many of our pilots are 55+ and would scoff at that idea? And who’s doing the negotiating for legacy pilots? Is it junior guys with quality of life on their mind or is it senior guys with money on their mind? We all know the answer.

Senior guys in control is nobody’s fault but our own. Over 50% of the list was hired after 2014 and have at least 15+ years to go. Once again, if you get the gray vote you win control. Why else would we have a US president with dementia?

notEnuf 11-24-2022 06:49 AM


Originally Posted by RunFast (Post 3536818)
Educate me, what is an escalator clause?

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/e...atorclause.asp


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