Airline Pilot Central Forums

Airline Pilot Central Forums (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/)

- Delta (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/delta/)

- - MOU 25-05 (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/delta/151540-mou-25-05-a.html)

Quote:

Originally Posted by 170Flyer (Post 3975275)

You’d absolutely have to do some serious research to come to an actual number but I don’t doubt for a second there a significant cost of downstream effects.

I know it’s anecdotal but recently this situation happened to me:

Late night GS comes out for a turn. I’m 1-2 pilots away from getting the trip and fully intend to fly it. 23.M.7 invoked.
IA call goes out. I try to get it but someone junior snipes the turn. Check the coverage report and the trip No-Opped.
Another GS comes out a few moments later. 23.M.7 again… this time I win the robocall lottery and get turn #2 as an IA
Show up to fly this new turn and talk to the CA. Turns out his FO got re routed to cover the same turn that No-Opped. The same turn I tried to get as a GS on step one of this journey.

Just walk through that single narrative and count how many times someone got paid to cover a single turn via the downstream effects. If this is happening at any meaningful scale the amount this problem costs the company can grow quite quickly. The challenge is doing the forensics necessary to find all these costs twice removed from the initial 23.M.7.

There’s a cost to the pilots too. How many times does this happen and what is the cost?

(Evening)
Wife: You off tomorrow?
Me: I have a green slip in, it’s running coverage, looks good, I’ll probably get the trip.
Wife: When will you know?
Me: Used to be fairly quick. Now? Probably hours.
Wife: I’m going to bed.
.
.
.
(2:00am)
Phone: Vibrate! Vibrate!, look at screen, “this is delta crew scheduling, calling for planetrain, if this is planetrain, press1, we are in inverse assignment for the following rotations”
Me: That’s the trip I wanted! (Screen glare bright enough wife wakes up too, ****ed)
Wife: so are you working?
Me: IDK, I have to call.
.
10 min later
.
Scheduler: …. Yeah sorry, that trip was covered 30 min ago by pilot #17,000
Me: Nope! Guess I’m free tomorrow.
Wife: Too late, I had to bail on our friends when you couldn’t commit last night.
Me and wife: toss and turn and can’t fall back asleep for an hour

Quote:

Originally Posted by Planetrain (Post 3975284)

Just put in a WS and all OBWSs. You'll sleep like a baby and never even know you are getting paid for 3 trips until you wake up fully refreshed in the morning. Check out 73NA. It's day 1 and there is a guy that already has 3 23M7 pay trips.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tennisguru (Post 3975281)

Why would the company ever agree to this? They’d have no way to effectively cover trips that pop up less than say 4 hours to report. They can’t still be covering a trip 6 hours after report time as they work through every step, even when it becomes fully automated.

they used to all the time back in the day as i'm sure you recall. It was very rare to see an IA on trip coverage. Now maybe stuff like reroutes and side deals happened more in the shadows and it was harder to tell..not sure, but I've had a ton of GS that reported in less than 2 hours and it was no issue. that was up until about about a year ago then a major shift seemed to happen

Quote:

Originally Posted by notEnuf (Post 3975286)

ATL320B has 6 today alone

Quote:

Originally Posted by Planetrain (Post 3975284)

I'm more worried about p1ssing off my wife than I am missing some stupid trip.

^ ^ ^ ^ ^

problems that people who just fly their schedule and aren't wracked by FOMO never have

Quote:

Originally Posted by Planetrain (Post 3975284)

This is spot on!

Quote:

Originally Posted by RightSide (Post 3975288)

ATL320B has 6 today alone

for a single individual? ...that's farming a cash crop for sure

saw another 320B that has 5

Quote:

Originally Posted by ancman (Post 3975263)

VAS doesn’t help with their cost problem. It’s #18 on the 23.O ladder. Most of the auto-accepts come well before that.

VAS pilots could help with operational integrity, but they’ll still end up paying an M7 pilot each time.

Except that's only if the flying gets put in OT. If tracking never puts it in OT, it can go straight to the VAS pilot. 23 EE 6 a.

Quote:

Originally Posted by notEnuf (Post 3975292)

for a single individual? ...that's farming a cash crop for sure

Between ATL and DTW 717A there have been four 23m7 today and the same ATL guy has three of them.