Originally Posted by Jack Bauer (Post 1195515)

Management will park more of the existing mainline fleet. The snapshot for ratios doesn't occur for a couple years. Everything in this new proposal that can be exploited will be. The above math equation will go lurching off into left field.

Originally Posted by newKnow (Post 1195498)

I've heard from several people that things were/are on fire in the ATL crewroom this afternoon...... (and not in a good way.)

Originally Posted by rvr350 (Post 1195535)

I salute the courage and time for the reps to stand around and answer, i mean sell, this TA in a angry crewroom.

Originally Posted by alfaromeo (Post 1194928)

The biggest mistake anyone can make is to assume that management is your friend. We have made our pilot group into a business partner with management That is what constructive engagement is, it is not going to birthday parties and yucking it up in the corporate boardroom.

We have added value to Delta in the last five years and they have put value back into our pockets. We have compounded gains into our contract at a rate that vastly exceeds other pilot groups. If we stop adding value to the company, they will put us to the side and ignore us for as long as they can. Events of the last five years have shown that we can sit for years, in fact many years with nothing happening in old school Section 6.

If you are unsure about what happens when you no longer are a business partner look what happened to Mesa (Freedom). As soon as they got on the bad side of Delta they went Scarface on them, they ended up in bankruptcy.

Here are the returns (both pay and DC plan) per year since bankruptcy exit:

2008 - 5.3% (average, some higher some lower)
2009 - 5%
2010 - 5%
2011 - 5%
2012 - 4% + 4%(TA) = 8.1% compounded
2013 - 8.5% (TA)
2014 - 4% (TA)
2015 - 3% (TA)

Quick, one of you financial gurus do a compounded return on that and let me know what you come up with.

Originally Posted by gloopy (Post 1195355)

Not only that, but we just gave them 300 pilot positions by gutting our already concessionary work rules. That is far more of a threat than the FTDT rules. Let them crew 9 hour US turns or EU flights and then go back to the gate and cancel on any taxi out delay and see how much they save.

Originally Posted by acl65pilot (Post 1195090)

88 pilots on reserve will probably see a 30% or so raise.

We all admit that this does not meet our expectations that we filled out in the survey.

The difference day one is 7.2% give or take. One must ask if the reward is worth the risk for 140 million dollars. Just an honest question.

You must take the emotion out of this, look at it objectively and go from there.

Originally Posted by Jack Bauer (Post 1195515)

Management will park more of the existing mainline fleet. The snapshot for ratios doesn't occur for a couple years. Everything in this new proposal that can be exploited will be. The above math equation will go lurching off into left field.

Originally Posted by Bill Lumberg (Post 1195124)

Yes, current 3 day trips with an allnighter attached at the end will be worth 13:30 instead of 11 hours. That is an improvement for many 737 and 767 pilots.

Originally Posted by Rather B Fishin (Post 1195405)

I think I agree with Carl on this one :eek:

Originally Posted by johnso29 (Post 1195555)

Do you have facts to back up your claim on us giving up 300 positions? I haven't seen that released by the union.