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Old 06-14-2012 | 02:34 AM
  #103481  
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Originally Posted by newKnow
Ok. THings are winding down and voting is right around the corner. But, this is one question I would like to see a straight-forward answer, without the artful dodge.

Can someone in the know tell me if this is a "zero cost" TA for the company? Thanks.
"These productivity enhancements combined with the ability to restructure our domestic network and retire inefficient 50-seat aircraft, add 717s and 76 seaters, provide significant value to Delta to cover the costs of our employee investments.” Richard Anderson – Delta CEO

"The fleet changes provided by this agreement, coupled with the productivity and profit sharing changes, cover the investments in our employees.” Mike Campbell – Delta EVP

"This is a cost neutral contract for the company and a lost opportunity for Delta pilots.” Tom Tucker Council 20
Old 06-14-2012 | 03:50 AM
  #103482  
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Default Outsourcing from a Consumer Perspective

Regional jets crowd skies, squeeze fliers - USATODAY.com

Regional jets crowd skies, squeeze fliers
By Bill McGee, special for USA TODAY Updated 13h 18m ago

Of all the changes that have overtaken the airline industry in recent years, one of the most dramatic has been the rapid transition to regional carriers, as "mainline" airlines outsource more and more flying to their regional "partners." You may be surprised to learn that 53 percent of all commercial airline departures in the United States today are operated by regional airlines.

Confusion persists

The number of passengers carried by U.S. regional airlines nearly doubled between 2000 and 2010, reaching 159 million at the end of the decade. Despite a slight downturn recently, the Federal Aviation Administration predicts passenger enplanements on regionals will rise by 3.5 percent through 2031.

Regional service grew as the airline industry's hub-and-spoke model expanded, with smaller commuter carriers operating on "thin" routes, often to small and rural communities. In fact, regional airlines provide the only air service at 484 airports nationwide. But today, regional aircraft also operate on some of the nation's densest routes and clog some of the most congested airports.

At the U.S. Department of Transportation's Future of Aviation Advisory Committee meetings in 2010, I raised the issue of booking transparency. That's because I hear constantly from readers who are confused over which airline they've booked, and many don't realize when they're buying tickets on the majors' partners and not on the majors. Last year the DOT responded by tightening rules that provide transparency for code-sharing flights, particularly with regional affiliates.

What I learned serving on the government's 'Future of Aviation' panel
Unfortunately, as regional flights become more ubiquitous, consumer confusion increases. Every day, tens of thousands of passengers book flights branded by major airlines but operated by regional partners. And even seasoned travelers are sometimes surprised by the differences.

Far from seamless

Major airlines insist there are no significant disparities when passengers fly on regional rather than mainline aircraft. But a brief rundown of some of the most pressing issues casts some doubt on such claims:

•Safety. In recent years the U.S. airline industry has posted a strong safety record. But while the industry notes there hasn't been a fatal "major" airline accident since 2001, there have been five fatal crashes of regional carriers operating on behalf of five different majors since then, resulting in 135 deaths:

•2003: Air Midwest doing business as (dba) US Airways Express
•2004: Pinnacle Airlines dba Northwest Airlink
•2004: Corporate Airlines dba AmericanConnection
•2006: Comair dba Delta Connection
•2009: Colgan Air dba Continental Connection

In the wake of the Colgan Air accident near Buffalo, the Airline Safety Act was passed to strengthen pilot hiring and training standards for regionals and to provide one level of safety among mainline carriers and regional partners. Yet a recent Senate hearing underscored that problems remain, with the Inspector General of the DOT testifying that the FAA "has not met timelines for raising pilot training standards, implementing mentoring programs, providing enhanced leadership skills to captains and increasing minimum pilot qualifications."

•Service/Comfort. Cabins are smaller on regional jets than on larger aircraft, and so are the seats. Also, many regional jets don't offer adqeuate overhead bins, galleys or premium seating. Some smaller planes are not even jetbridge-compatible, necessitating outdoor boarding and deplaning. When business or first classes are provided, often they don't consist of considerably larger seats, hot meals or any number of entertainment products offered by the same airlines on larger planes. What's more, access for the handicapped and compatibility of child-restraint systems can be much more difficult.

•Reliability. According to the DOT's most recent annual rankings, regionals were dead last among the 16 domestic carriers rated for mishandled baggage, and dead last with the most canceled flights. Several regionals also ranked at the bottom for involuntarily bumping passengers. Furthermore, making sense of the DOT's monthly Air Travel Consumer Reports can be difficult because regional operators are broken out separately from the mainline airline partners they represent. This can be particularly confusing because a mainline airline can contract with as many as eight different regionals, while a single regional carrier can contract with multiple mainlines; therefore their service rankings are a muddled mess.

•Environment. As I learned while researching this topic, examining commercial aviation's carbon footprint is a complex undertaking. But while we all await further technological advancements, the most controllable way to reduce the nation's airborne pollutants is the controversial solution of reexamining how airlines schedule their aircraft. For example, the Regional Airline Association notes that every morning regionals operate 30 of the 35 nonstop departures between Washington and New York, hardly a "thin" route between small markets. Clogging gates, taxiways, runways, and airways with smaller airplanes rather than consolidating such flights with larger aircraft is a big-picture problem that has been left to the airline industry to address—ineffectively. An even more sensible solution is to reexamine where and when alternative transportation modes such as rail should be considered.

Buyer beware

The best advice when you book ANY flight through ANY booking channel—online or offline, through an airline or through a third-party ticket seller—is to ensure you're clear on which carrier is actually operating the flight. If you have doubts, don't book until you're satisfied.
Old 06-14-2012 | 05:10 AM
  #103483  
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So why didn't that guy add to his article that one major carrier was shifting capacity from its regional feed to its mainline carrier?

Oh that's right because if you get your way there won't be any reason for us to do so. Got it.
Old 06-14-2012 | 05:16 AM
  #103484  
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Originally Posted by SailorJerry
So why didn't that guy add to his article that one major carrier was shifting capacity from its regional feed to its mainline carrier?

Oh that's right because if you get your way there won't be any reason for us to do so. Got it.
My way would be to fly additional 76-seaters or greater at mainline.
Old 06-14-2012 | 05:57 AM
  #103485  
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Originally Posted by Elvis90
My way would be to fly additional 76-seaters or greater at mainline.
That got shot down in negotiations. We will have to shoot this TA down for another shot at that.
Old 06-14-2012 | 05:58 AM
  #103486  
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Originally Posted by johnso29
That got shot down in negotiations. We will have to shoot this TA down for another shot at that.
I plan to do my part.
Old 06-14-2012 | 06:05 AM
  #103487  
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Originally Posted by johnso29

That got shot down in negotiations. We will have to shoot this TA down for another shot at that.
How many TAs would you shoot down to get that sweet Canadian lovin? One? Two? 10?

I'm trying to judge if you're committed or insane. I'm leaning towards the latter.
Old 06-14-2012 | 06:16 AM
  #103488  
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Bill,

Explain to me how we are going to get all this pilot growth when these guys are displaced off the widebodies? I also don't believe these mainline reductions will require any reductions at DCI...how is that ratio gonna help us with this?


NEW YORK (CNNMoney) -- Few industries are hit as hard by high oil prices than the airlines, which can spend close to 40% of their budget on fuel.
With jet fuel prices near record highs, the drive to conserve is stronger than ever.

Delta recently made headlines with its novel bid to buy an oil refinery, taking a more direct role in procuring fuel. But Delta and other airlines are experimenting with a number of other ways to cut costs.
The entire industry is hoping a switch from radar to GPS-based navigation will cut the time it takes both to reach cruising altitude and land a plane.
A Delta spokesman said GPS systems can get a plane on the ground 2 or 3 minutes faster than radar by allowing the plane to descend in one fell swoop instead of a series of steps. Since the planes burn about $100 minute in fuel, that can shave a few hundred dollars off of each landing.
A few hundred dollars may not sound like much, especially since Delta spent $12 billion last year on fuel. But considering Delta (DAL, Fortune 500) lands over 1,000 planes a day in Atlanta alone, the savings can add up fast.
The airline also cut long-haul flights by around 10% last year, and plans another 10% reduction this year.
Long-haul flights burn more fuel per mile than short trips because extra weight is added by the extra fuel needed to make the trip.
Delta's risky oil refinery bet
"Fuel is expensive, so we're being very careful about where we fly," said Delta spokesman Eric Torbenson, adding that Delta is making sure all its routes can cover the cost of fuel.
Delta is also replacing 88 of its 50-seat regional jets with larger, 100-passenger versions, because the larger jets get better mileage per passenger.
At United, replacing aircraft is also part of the strategy.
United is putting 19 of the most advanced 737's into service this year, as well as five of Boeing's (BA, Fortune 500) new ultra-efficient 787 Dreamliners. The new aircraft are 15% to 20% more efficient than the planes they will replace.
Like other airlines, United (UAL, Fortune 500) has put winglets on the tips of many of its aircraft's wings, which reduce drag and can cut fuel use by up to 5%.

It's also swapping out parts, such as the 800-pound steel brakes on some 737's with lighter, carbon-fiber equipment.
"We have a long-term approach in place," said Joel Booth, who flew 777's for United before taking a job as the airline's head of fuel efficiency. "This is very important to our businesses."
Booth said that efficiency efforts last year saved the airline 60 million gallons of fuel - or nearly $200 million at today's prices. In 2011 the airline spent nearly $13 billion on fuel.
Oil boom chasers: Next stop, Kansas
United's overhaul also extends beyond its aircraft.
The company has over 3,600 ground support vehicles such as baggage tractors and aircraft tugs that run on either alternative fuel or electricity -- a move being made by other airlines too.
Southwest extends its cost savings strategy beyond the airport entirely.
Like most airlines, Southwest (LUV, Fortune 500) engages in extensive hedging for its fuel -- a practice where the airline basically bets fuel prices will be higher in the future and locks in contracts with Wall Street traders and others willing to take the opposite side of that bet.
The airline received considerable attention in 2007-2008 when it was hedged more so than most airlines when oil prices spiked -- a strategy that paid off handsomely.
Over the last decade or so Southwest's trading strategy has saved over $3 billion in fuel costs, said Chris Monroe, the airline's head of risk management.
Currently Southwest, which spent $6 billion on fuel last year, has hedges out to 2015. But the airline is basically unhedged through the first half of this year, meaning it thinks fuel prices will continue falling for at least another month.
First Published: June 1, 2012: 5:28 AM ET


There goes your captain seat...
Old 06-14-2012 | 06:23 AM
  #103489  
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From: A big one that looks like a little one
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Originally Posted by formerdal
Bill,

Explain to me how we are going to get all this pilot growth when these guys are displaced off the widebodies? I also don't believe these mainline reductions will require any reductions at DCI...how is that ratio gonna help us with this?

There goes your captain seat...
Yes so by immediately voting NO tomorrow you'll ensure that all the flying in the world can be transferred to rehabbed 50 seaters while Delta furloughs. Yes. Smart. I like the way you think. It's crisp and wordly and not in the slightest bit selfish or entitled.
Old 06-14-2012 | 06:25 AM
  #103490  
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Originally Posted by johnso29
That got shot down in negotiations. We will have to shoot this TA down for another shot at that.
I am curious what will make the company agree to that? I feel that 76 seat aircraft are not recoverable. No matter how much table pounding is going to get it back at this time. I do feel however, as the industry evolves and the pilot shortage becomes real, there will be an opportunity to further contain scope of the likes in this TA and bring more of the DCI flying to mainline and we could see 76 seats back at mainline. Today, DAL has no incentive to do so and to think we can just send it back to demand something else has its own perils.

We will pay for any improvements in another TA, we may get 5% more but we will give it up somewhere else. It is a negotiation. If we want to demand and hold our breath, the company has more options time and money to do what they will. The is a small win (i wish it were more), in 2 1/2 years we may be getting nothing or a bigger win, but we will be much better off with this TA than without.

I also see that if DAL wants to merge or assume assets from say (AMR) on JULY 2,2012, they will need our cooperation and they will indeed be looking to provide incentives for our cooperation. That would mean this TA was just improved that much more. Heck every time a side letter needs to be signed fine. Just give me 1 or 2% pay increase.
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