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Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?

Old 11-29-2012 | 07:17 AM
  #116621  
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Purple is simply the Id found in all of us. Best not to annoy it.



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Old 11-29-2012 | 07:24 AM
  #116622  
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Originally Posted by forgot to bid


they don't put that in the brochure.
Even if they did, we never read read it anyway.
Old 11-29-2012 | 07:25 AM
  #116623  
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Originally Posted by Sink r8
How do JV's help prevent Delta furloughs in a downturn, Rogue? Isn't the purpose of the entire evolution to protect MARGINS, even in a down cycle?
Gives more pax access to our flights, allows more flights to be booked by DAL pax(viability of existing routes that otherwise would be marginal), and reduces the need for DAL to take on more debt to serve a marginally logical route that at first whiff of fiscal issues would be dumped and the jets and debt would remain.

Keeps DAL financially strong with the reach and access for revenue without the need for high debt load.

The aviation world is changing and I expect to see these sort of JV's morph over time.

Pilots all want a little boom and and sick of bust. That cannot be discredited.
Old 11-29-2012 | 07:36 AM
  #116624  
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From: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
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Originally Posted by Rogue24
Gives more pax access to our flights, allows more flights to be booked by DAL pax(viability of existing routes that otherwise would be marginal), and reduces the need for DAL to take on more debt to serve a marginally logical route that at first whiff of fiscal issues would be dumped and the jets and debt would remain.

Keeps DAL financially strong with the reach and access for revenue without the need for high debt load.

The aviation world is changing and I expect to see these sort of JV's morph over time.

Pilots all want a little boom and and sick of bust. That cannot be discredited.
... or, in other words ... by never hiring, we avoid the hassle of firing ...

Short of the 717 staffing, which is at the bottom of the list, my guess is that we would be furloughing instead of hiring. A level that we've been "on the bubble" for a while.


So, while these JV's are allegedly revenue neutral ... what fee does Delta get for selling a ticket? Do they waive those fees? So, is this form of outsourcing really not profitable for Delta?

There may be a buyer's market in real estate and historically low interest rates, but one would be a fool to make that deal without a reasonable assurance of future employment. Not knowing makes conservative financial planning very difficult.

Last edited by Bucking Bar; 11-29-2012 at 08:11 AM.
Old 11-29-2012 | 07:52 AM
  #116625  
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Originally Posted by Bucking Bar
... or, in other words ... by never hiring, we avoid the hassle of firing ...

Short of the 717 staffing, which is at the bottom of the list, my guess is that we would be furloughing instead of hiring. A level that we've been "on the bubble" for a while.


So, while these JV's are allegedly revenue neutral ... what fee does Delta get for selling a ticket? Do they waive those fees? So, is this form of outsourcing really not profitable for Delta?

While Sailing and the Choir sing to "be thankful" the truth is any pilot with any sense should not be in any kind of debt right now. There may be a buyer's market in real estate and historically low interest rates, but one would be a fool to make that deal without a reasonable assurance of future employment. Not knowing makes conservative financial planning very difficult.

Do not forget that DAL has incentive to fly pax on the V Australia JV. Unlike the AF one.

Not hiring to avoid hiring, but not hiring excessively to avoid furloughing.
Old 11-29-2012 | 08:01 AM
  #116626  
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From: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
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Originally Posted by Rogue24
DO not forget that DAL has incentive to fly pax on the V Australia JV. Unlike the AF one.

Not hiring to avoid hiring, but not hiring excessively to avoid furloughing.
I get that, but we pretty much stopped hiring five years ago. We are down nearly 25% since the merger and down 10.9% since just last year. Where is the bottom for this airline? ( I am impressed that one of the promises kept out of the merger is not to furlough us )

Once again the question is, time to move on, again? The answer is "probably not." But, good news would be most welcome. Instead we get more variations on the market retrenchment / outsourcing scheme.

For employees who have been on the bubble for over a decade as a result of Delta's various outsourcing schemes ... it does get very old.

Last edited by Bucking Bar; 11-29-2012 at 08:12 AM.
Old 11-29-2012 | 08:14 AM
  #116627  
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From: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Default Little Local Good News

For the approach to 26R ...



Porsche finally breaks ground on new HQ in Georgia
Old 11-29-2012 | 08:18 AM
  #116628  
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Originally Posted by Bucking Bar
I get that, but we pretty much stopped hiring five years ago. We are down nearly 25% since the merger and down 10.9% since just last year. Where is the bottom for this airline? ( I am impressed that one of the promises kept out of the merger is not to furlough us )

Once again the question is, time to move on, again? The answer is "probably not," but good news would be most welcome. Instead we get more variations on the market retrenchment / outsourcing scheme.

For employees who have been on the bubble for over a decade as a result of Delta's various outsourcing schemes ... it does get very old.
My opinion:

If the industry every fully recovers, there is going to be decent growth here. These JV's set up for that.

Keep in mind that we have seen very little up side since the AF JV was signed. The power in the JV's for us has never been realized. If we ever see growth we will see it.

In the interim, the JV has allowed DAL, not the DAL pilot, a network to fly their pax on without the commensurate CAPEX in a financial environment where rapid international growth is not sustainable. What that has offered the DAL pilot is less tangible; stagnation, no furloughs and a company that can support the staffing carrying cost while paying down debt, making decent profits on mid level margins, and is better positioning themselves for the future.

Again, pilots want growth, but a company that when it grows can sustain and support it is much desired over a company that grows for market share than caves under the debt burden (DAL ala last decade)
Old 11-29-2012 | 08:21 AM
  #116629  
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Originally Posted by Bucking Bar
I get that, but we pretty much stopped hiring five years ago. We are down nearly 25% since the merger and down 10.9% since just last year. Where is the bottom for this airline? ( I am impressed that one of the promises kept out of the merger is not to furlough us )

Once again the question is, time to move on, again? The answer is "probably not," but good news would be most welcome. Instead we get more variations on the market retrenchment / outsourcing scheme.

For employees who have been on the bubble for over a decade as a result of Delta's various outsourcing schemes ... it does get very old.
So where would you go next? After all this restructuring is completed where will the next fast growing sector appear? I'm not entirely sure there is another definite winner out there given macro influences. The risks seem to be spread around quite well in the industry. You could call a winner within a given short timeframe. I just don't enjoy the other cultures that much. I'd much prefer to work on a secondary and stay in my timezone...not to be confused with Douglas effect on time zones...taking one back in time to the days of large disheveled mustaches...which suit me well.
Old 11-29-2012 | 08:30 AM
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Originally Posted by hockeypilot44
I can see that super model's nipple.
I can see where it's suppose to be!!!
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