Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
08-13-2013 | 12:57 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: May 2012
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Isn't that what happens during the entirety of contract negotiations? The entire contract has parts that are negotiated and might somewhat benefit one particular group (demographic as you say) over another, and that can be construed as having taken from one pot of money to put in another.
Improving lineholder workrules vs reserve (and vice versa), increase hourly pay vs retirement (401k) pay, improve scope vs using that neg. capitol for something else, etc. etc. etc. Pick any part of the contract that has been negotiated and someone out there can claim it was done at the "expense" of others.....
08-13-2013 | 01:00 PM
Straight QOL, homie
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 4,202
Likes: 1
From: Record-Shattering Profit Facilitator
I guess it would be nice if the company recognized that fact as the cost of doing business, and didn't force us to negotiate for consideration. You know, since we're a family and all.
08-13-2013 | 01:02 PM
Straight QOL, homie
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 4,202
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From: Record-Shattering Profit Facilitator
Everyone needs to make more money with more time off. Not one or the other (or neither).
08-13-2013 | 01:16 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Apr 2008
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For crying out loud. How long have you guys been in the airline business?!?
No matter, we are here to help...
we have a rotation construction committee, who I would imagine is responsible for the continued 5 days trips set up primarily for commuters. We have hotels for qualification training even for ATL based commuters, we have hotels for ATL recurrent, Atlanta residents get a day less pay for recurrent because they are not afforded the day of commuting in either side. We have a commuting policy which is generous, IMO, especially in light that Delta postures to afford the same opportunities for non-contract personnel as contract. Indeed we even negotiated the flight attendant Jumpseat for use by the pilots, and we can't even get some them to use it in order to help OTHER commuters. Front and back end deviation with a proffer of a hotel on both sides, just in case you can't deviate, positive space transportation to your residence instead of back to your base. No matter....
My opinion.
No matter, we are here to help...
we have a rotation construction committee, who I would imagine is responsible for the continued 5 days trips set up primarily for commuters. We have hotels for qualification training even for ATL based commuters, we have hotels for ATL recurrent, Atlanta residents get a day less pay for recurrent because they are not afforded the day of commuting in either side. We have a commuting policy which is generous, IMO, especially in light that Delta postures to afford the same opportunities for non-contract personnel as contract. Indeed we even negotiated the flight attendant Jumpseat for use by the pilots, and we can't even get some them to use it in order to help OTHER commuters. Front and back end deviation with a proffer of a hotel on both sides, just in case you can't deviate, positive space transportation to your residence instead of back to your base. No matter....
My opinion.
08-13-2013 | 01:19 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 478
Likes: 0
Isn't that what happens during the entirety of contract negotiations? The entire contract has parts that are negotiated and might somewhat benefit one particular group (demographic as you say) over another, and that can be construed as having taken from one pot of money to put in another.
Improving lineholder workrules vs reserve (and vice versa), increase hourly pay vs retirement (401k) pay, improve scope vs using that neg. capitol for something else, etc. etc. etc. Pick any part of the contract that has been negotiated and someone out there can claim it was done at the "expense" of others.....
Improving lineholder workrules vs reserve (and vice versa), increase hourly pay vs retirement (401k) pay, improve scope vs using that neg. capitol for something else, etc. etc. etc. Pick any part of the contract that has been negotiated and someone out there can claim it was done at the "expense" of others.....
08-13-2013 | 01:22 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 489
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And one of the points is that no matter how much something has been improved, there will always be someone who will claim "they" should have gotten more for their contract issue de jour instead of the money going elsewhere.
To say that every single person can be made to be 100% happy with what they and everybody else got, or didn't get, is a bit naive. We're dealing with human nature here.
we shouldn't have to pick and choose who gets the fresh cheese.
08-13-2013 | 01:36 PM
Lifelong commuter
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 189
Likes: 6
I'm ATL based and a commuter...I've never gotten an extra day of pay just because I commute. Prior to the new hotel -for- training policy, I bought a lot of rooms out of my own pocket.
Brakechatter, I think lots of guys and gals respect what you stand for and your support of all pilots. From one dude to another, you need to step back and take a breath. I know there's other things going on in your life that might bias your views today and it may be throwing you off kilter a bit.
My two cents.
Brakechatter, I think lots of guys and gals respect what you stand for and your support of all pilots. From one dude to another, you need to step back and take a breath. I know there's other things going on in your life that might bias your views today and it may be throwing you off kilter a bit.
My two cents.
08-13-2013 | 01:44 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 478
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I'm ATL based and a commuter...I've never gotten an extra day of pay just because I commute. Prior to the new hotel -for- training policy, I bought a lot of rooms out of my own pocket.
Brakechatter, I think lots of guys and gals respect what you stand for and your support of all pilots. From one dude to another, you need to step back and take a breath. I know there's other things going on in your life that might bias your views today and it may be throwing you off kilter a bit.
My two cents.
Brakechatter, I think lots of guys and gals respect what you stand for and your support of all pilots. From one dude to another, you need to step back and take a breath. I know there's other things going on in your life that might bias your views today and it may be throwing you off kilter a bit.
My two cents.
08-13-2013 | 01:48 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 922
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From: Decoupled
At the risk of being the tool of the day, maybe we should emphasize improving the relocation benefits. If they close a base, it should cost the Company, not the individual.
I've been at three closed bases. I've taken a paid move twice. I've done the commute without a jumpseat. I live in base now. I'd rather live elsewhere, but that will have to wait for retirement. I'm not willing to commute anymore.
We've done a lot to make commuters lives better. Why not improve the moving benefits? The Corporation can afford it. It's a cost of doing business.
08-13-2013 | 02:11 PM
Runs with scissors
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 7,847
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From: Going to hell in a bucket, but enjoying the ride .
In disagree that this a no/low cost item for starters.
I would also submit that you checked the box that asked if you were willing to relocate when you applied.
The problem with you is that you don't care if someone had to walk to school both ways in 8 foot snowdrifts. MY point was that I have been in your shoes, I made it work without a commuting policy, and we have made enough dispensation for commuters in our contract, IMO.
Seeing the world through "their" eyes only has burned the Delta pilots more than once. Some people never learn I guess.
As for say in the matter, I have as much as you. You instruct your reps and I will instruct mine. Expressing my sorrow was indicative that I understood your plight and felt your pain, yet arrive at a different conclusion.
I no longer carry that sympathy for you. Perhaps we may get something for getting RID of the commuter clause. Maybe that needs some costing/negotiating/changing. You would do better to keep silent on the issue, for you do not help your cause with the sleeper cells on here. Somehow I think you won't heed that advice.
So did you check the willing to relocate box?
I would also submit that you checked the box that asked if you were willing to relocate when you applied.
The problem with you is that you don't care if someone had to walk to school both ways in 8 foot snowdrifts. MY point was that I have been in your shoes, I made it work without a commuting policy, and we have made enough dispensation for commuters in our contract, IMO.
Seeing the world through "their" eyes only has burned the Delta pilots more than once. Some people never learn I guess.
As for say in the matter, I have as much as you. You instruct your reps and I will instruct mine. Expressing my sorrow was indicative that I understood your plight and felt your pain, yet arrive at a different conclusion.
I no longer carry that sympathy for you. Perhaps we may get something for getting RID of the commuter clause. Maybe that needs some costing/negotiating/changing. You would do better to keep silent on the issue, for you do not help your cause with the sleeper cells on here. Somehow I think you won't heed that advice.
So did you check the willing to relocate box?
Delta was by far my first choice airline to work for, and at the time of my interview they had a lot more bases that are now closed, and there were very few commuters, only the most senior Capts. who were commuting to ATL to the L10-11/Int. to bump up their final average earnings commuted.
BUT...if, in the interview they had told me, "Well, you MUST live in ATL, no commuting, and we are going to close BOS and MIA." I would have gotten up and left and gone to my 3rd round of interviews at American, who by the way, still has both a MIA and BOS base (and DFW and ORD, like Delta had back then) and who still have their retirements!
Last edited by Timbo; 08-13-2013 at 02:35 PM.
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