Your post brings up a couple of questions:

1. How are all the Japanese carriers doing financially?
2. How are the Japanese carriers affecting the profitability of the Delta Narita operation?

JAL has officially denied Delta talks. Delta isn't commenting. It seems the only people excited about commenting are Japanese bureaucrats and Delta pilots.

Should the DAL share purchase prove to be true, I hope our MEC and its leaders have a strategic, long term view rather than the defeatist, protectionist views espoused by some others on this board.

ACL, I'm disappointed.

Actually JAL won't have cargo for long.

JAL Cargo is in the process of merging with NCA. It's basically a move to rehab JAL by shedding/monetizing non-core businesses. The japanese government has a heavy hand in this...

Cheers
George

You should not be disappointed at all. I know you just broke for lunch. There is huge potential here, and there is a huge potential for some major negatives for this group. I think that even you can see that.

The devil is in the details. Depending on those detail, it could be good or bad for this group.

This is totally different than the AF deal. This is purchasing a major stake in a foreign carrier. I like the way they are thinking. From a corporate perspective this totally undermines one of our biggest competitors, that is a good thing. It also is great insurance to getting nailed if the adopt Open Skies. I agree with that. There is a huge upside if it is done correct.

From a pilot perspective, DAL MIGHT be purchasing a controlling interest in a foreign carrier. That has huge implications for us. They could quite easily do all of the NRT flying, a lot of the potential Pacific Rim flying, and a lot of the dedicated Cargo Haul flying that will be coming. Those are potential jobs for DAL pilots. This could have a huge up side for us, it all depends on the wording in the agreement between us and the company.

Even you have to admit that the stakes are a lot different than with AF/KLM. I want you and the MEC to get it right. I have hope you will.

As a stakeholder, I like seeing DAL talking a opportunity like this, as a pilot it worries me. We bought NWA for the NRT deal. Now we are buying JAL in effect. Great news is it works out to our favor.

They love their DC-9 family, if they keep this up we may see production resume.

Its a phenomenal terminal but I think that a) DTW is a struggling city in a struggling state, if only there was a town in the middle of the country that is big, vibrant and profitable for an airline... i wonder... and b) DTW will destroy the landing gear of the fleet if they don't get those taxiways fixed.

But remember, there is more money to be made flying in banks then flying without.

Ain't that the truth!

It's good insurace against loosing 5th freedom rights and the move to Haneda but at what cost to the pilot group?

JV's could potentially be the RJ of this decade if we're not carefull about it.

Cheers
George

Exactly there is some major insurance with it. Like I said the devil is in the details.

And Slow, I am disappointed that you do not see the fact that I see the potential and corporate genius behind this. Protecting the turf of the DAL pilots comes with the terretory. It is the job of the reps to do what is best for this group. If successful, this will further place us at the top of the world industry. In effect it is like Nation Building, and Delta is taking advantage at the bottom of the industry.
A rubber stamp may be all that is required, but we also need to make sure we are not setting ourselves up to get duped. That is where my concern lies. I just do not want to see DAL pilots lose jobs, upward potential, etc because of a deal. It is as simple as that.

Share the details with me and I will tell you what I exactly think.

What percentage of flying is JV
What percentage of flying is DCI
What percentage of flying is Codeshare

We need to put this in writing real quick.

In addition we need to define "flying" in terms of:
-Aircraft
-ASM
-Flights
-Passengers
-Pilots

or someone else will define "flying" for us

As the very recent past has shown even some of our newest agreements can easily be interpreted multiple ways, often to our detriment.

Cheers
George

All good points, and the best way is inclusive scope. Define what a Delta pilot will fly, not what they will not, add a qualifier or two for every thing we just cannot foresee.

Really?

Slowplay, how would anyone have a strategic view of this potential transaction without studying the details and seeing the language.

In fact, where are the details and language in the AF/KLM JV?

Where is there any effective communication from DALPA much less specific information on the JV's?

So now you are going to paint a majority of the "other candidates" with the "defeatist, protectionist" brush. Did it ever occur to you that there is a reason these "other candidates" are running and their agendas have gained serious momentum within the pilot group. Did it not occur to you that people like yourself are contributing to and fueling this backlash against the MEC chair and his adminstration?

It is time the association starts communicating, putting the facts out, and letting the pilots decide and vote on these issues that are paramount to our jobs.

-T

One of the biggest things I hear. Communicate the good, bad and the ugly with the rank and file.


There is potential good here for us the DAL pilots, but we just cannot sit there and not take some a hard look at it. We need the pilot group to error check the JV.

It will flow more passengers in to our network, but the fact is that we could have already done this in NRT. I agree, I want details.