Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
04-04-2014, 07:16 PM
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10 phone calls from SKDS. 5 on the cell, 5 on the house phone. However, I am off tomorrow. If I were scheduled for a less than legal rest, I don't see how I could defend the position of "Sure, I got my 8 hours of un-interrupted FAR required rest". It'll be interesting to see how many guys abide by the FARs, and how many go out on a limb to an indefensible position for the good of the company.
04-04-2014, 07:22 PM
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I think it's pretty clear they can only call once without breaking the 10 hour rest.
The FAA has a “one phone call” policy that “generally” allows a certificate holder to initiate one phone call during a crewmember’s rest period. If the crewmember voluntarily chooses to answer the phone call, the FAA does not view the phone call as disruptive and breaking the rest period. However, a flightcrew member may have difficulty getting back to sleep after being woken up by a certificate holder’s phone call. In that situation, a flightcrew member may have his/her sleep opportunity interrupted. Thus, a certificate holder runs the risk of interrupting a flightcrew member’s sleep opportunity during the rest period by making a phone call.
The FAA has a “one phone call” policy that “generally” allows a certificate holder to initiate one phone call during a crewmember’s rest period. If the crewmember voluntarily chooses to answer the phone call, the FAA does not view the phone call as disruptive and breaking the rest period. However, a flightcrew member may have difficulty getting back to sleep after being woken up by a certificate holder’s phone call. In that situation, a flightcrew member may have his/her sleep opportunity interrupted. Thus, a certificate holder runs the risk of interrupting a flightcrew member’s sleep opportunity during the rest period by making a phone call.
What you're discussing is whether the company is violating FAA policy, and you seem to be equating that with pilots violating FAR's. Pilots have a duty not to fly if they're not in compliance with 117.25. If they determine their sleep was interrupted, they need to act accordingly.
If a pilot doesn't determine that they lost the required sleep opportunity, they're not illegal. Maybe it's because they didn't hear the phone, didn't have it on, whatever.
Bottom line: the calls going out do not equate a pilot violating FAR's. They might mean the company has some splainin' to do, and in many cases, multiple calls = interruption from a pilot perspective. In some cases, however, even one call is too many.
Last edited by Sink r8; 04-04-2014 at 07:43 PM.
04-04-2014, 07:27 PM
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10 phone calls from SKDS. 5 on the cell, 5 on the house phone. However, I am off tomorrow. If I were scheduled for a less than legal rest, I don't see how I could defend the position of "Sure, I got my 8 hours of un-interrupted FAR required rest". It'll be interesting to see how many guys abide by the FARs, and how many go out on a limb to an indefensible position for the good of the company.
For most human beings actually getting the calls, and getting awoken each time, I agree with you: I don't see how you can possibly report fit for duty.
If there is a guy out there that turns his phone off, or doesn't lose sleep over a phone ringing because his girlfriend calls all the time, or whatever, and doesn't determine that his sleep is interrupted... he's not in violation.
04-04-2014, 07:28 PM
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Well, I have to go to bed, and get some uninterrupted sleep. Good night.
04-04-2014, 07:33 PM
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I'm not claiming I know much about 117, but I just read 117.25 (e) and (f), which seems to be the pertinent text, and I'm just saying that we have a duty to not to fly if we (the pilot) determine that the 8-hour sleep opportunity was interrupted. We also have the right to 10 hours free of duty. If you determine that your sleep was interrupted, then I think you should call and get an additional 8 hours sleep opportunity.
No one but you knows whether your opportunity was interrupted, and it's no based on the number of calls. Construction at the hotel might interrupt it, and you might sleep through a phone call, or turn it off and miss the subsequent interruptions. The reason I'm pointing this out, is that you shouldn't link the number of calls with an automatic interruption. In some cases, one is too many. I don't want people to think that the company is allowed to wake them up just once, but two calls is illegal. The regulations don't state that.
I don't know where the one-call "rule" comes from. It's on the 117 FAQ's on deltanet, but so is the nonsense about reserves having to acknowledge earlier than the contract.
No one but you knows whether your opportunity was interrupted, and it's no based on the number of calls. Construction at the hotel might interrupt it, and you might sleep through a phone call, or turn it off and miss the subsequent interruptions. The reason I'm pointing this out, is that you shouldn't link the number of calls with an automatic interruption. In some cases, one is too many. I don't want people to think that the company is allowed to wake them up just once, but two calls is illegal. The regulations don't state that.
I don't know where the one-call "rule" comes from. It's on the 117 FAQ's on deltanet, but so is the nonsense about reserves having to acknowledge earlier than the contract.
04-04-2014, 07:34 PM
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04-04-2014, 07:37 PM
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For all needing 8 solid hours of sleep just pop an Ambien and you're good to go. Wait, can't do that unless you have 24 hours before you fly?
Out of curiosity, does anyone get 8 hours of sleep before a 04:30 van? I know I can't.
Out of curiosity, does anyone get 8 hours of sleep before a 04:30 van? I know I can't.
04-04-2014, 08:04 PM
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It will be interesting to see what flight ops does about this. Anybody who acknowledged one of those calls electronically and then turns a wheel in less than 10 hours from that time is subject to getting their ticket pulled by the FAA.
How is Delta going to get around that?
How is Delta going to get around that?
Have no fear, I'm sure that by 2am there will be another round (or 7) of Robo Calls with Steve Dickson telling you it's ok to ignore those earlier Robo Calls...
04-05-2014, 01:48 AM
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Numerous robocalls because of a delayed PBS bid package, but if your departure tomorrow is delayed? Crickets.
04-05-2014, 03:14 AM
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