Originally Posted by forgot to bid

I am going to bet, imho btw, that we'd do alright in that situation. Not only because of Trainer but because if oil prices spike this weak economy is probably going to crash some more.

If that happens then demand may drop and prices may have to drop and UCAL and AMR will have to pay for those modernized fleets plus deal with their large 50-seat fleets with less revenue. We have a less expensive fleet to maintain on routes where revenue would take the largest hit.

I've heard it said on the missions they run the 88 fleet even with old engines is pretty cost efficient.

I also remember prior to 9/11 how CAL had this new fleet and all these newly leased airplanes while NWA and DAL had old fleets. 9/11 happens and Bethune hit the panic button real quick, if felt like they were operating with maxed out credit cards. It was not an enviable position.

I could be wrong.

Originally Posted by Purple Drank

Example: complete lack of leadership regarding SD's contract-altering memo.

How much negotiating capital was squandered and time wasted by dithering and accepting the company steamrolling our contract? Firm resolve and direction was what we needed. We got it...from management.

Doesn't bode well for C15. The company knows Dalpa will roll over when steamrolled.

Originally Posted by Alan Shore

Clearly you are not referring to the pilots who had the lost pay from their reserve PDs fully restored and any record of missed assignments expunged, so to whom are you referring?

Originally Posted by forgot to bid

I am going to bet, imho btw, that we'd do alright in that situation. Not only because of Trainer but because if oil prices spike this weak economy is probably going to crash some more.

If that happens then demand may drop and prices may have to drop and UCAL and AMR will have to pay for those modernized fleets plus deal with their large 50-seat fleets with less revenue. We have a less expensive fleet to maintain on routes where revenue would take the largest hit.

I've heard it said on the missions they run the 88 fleet even with old engines is pretty cost efficient.

I also remember prior to 9/11 how CAL had this new fleet and all these newly leased airplanes while NWA and DAL had old fleets. 9/11 happens and Bethune hit the panic button real quick, if felt like they were operating with maxed out credit cards. It was not an enviable position.

I could be wrong.

Originally Posted by sailingfun

Steamrolled right into the best contract in the industry. Reminds me of a SLC 727 CA who used to love to tell new hires how badly Delta screwed him in the NE merger. This was after telling them about his 3 homes. One new SO replied, "man I sure hope I get screwed in the next merger as bad as you did".

Originally Posted by Flamer

You know that I am. Those pilots were held hostage (all RES pilots actually) until a time and place of the company's choosing where the company could get what they wanted in return. Surely you are not insinuating that strong union leadership and pilot unity prevented an absolute breech of our contract immediately?

Originally Posted by Flamer

I'm not saying our contract is bad now, but it isn't the best out there when looking at it as a whole.

Originally Posted by Flamer

Well, we haven't had 727s for quite some time so you might want to get some updated data points. Find a friend at SWA or FDX and compare W2/TAFB in like categories.

Unless you are going to tell me they are not in our peer group.

Also, since you are speaking in present tense, you can skip the part about how good it was for DAL in the past or how bad it is going to be for the others in the future. I'm not saying our contract is bad now, but it isn't the best out there when looking at it as a whole.

Originally Posted by Flamer

You know that I am. Those pilots were held hostage (all RES pilots actually) until a time and place of the company's choosing where the company could get what they wanted in return. Surely you are not insinuating that strong union leadership and pilot unity prevented an absolute breech of our contract immediately?

Originally Posted by Rather B Fishin

Please read the RLA. Have you ever heard of the legal term "fly now, grieve later"? Do you know how long a system board of adjustment usually takes to reach a settlement?