I was comparing the results of differing approaches to bankruptcy. There are three reasons why your chart is of no significance to that comparison:

1. You look at contracts from 2014, more than 8 years after the last bankruptcy contract was signed
2. You include in your comparison companies that never went bankrupt
3. You include Fedex and UPS which aren't even companies that compete in our industry

There are numerous reasons why your chart is useless even in today's environment, but that also isn't germane to my argument. The question was "does taking concessions prior to bankruptcy end up in a worse outcome than waiting for bankruptcy?"

The answer still remains that the two carriers that took concessions prior to bankruptcy did better than the two that did not.

 

You KNOW that the C20 resolution that failed at the regular March 2010 MEC meeting was not the genesis of the MEC direction in August 2013.

You also KNOW that the direction was given by the majority of the Reps in Aug 2013 after having been briefed by the Scheduling Committee that this was an option to try to reduce the number of days worked by pilots in light of the then upcoming FAR 117.

CDO's were seen as a unique option to work less days for a premium and to minimize the 30 hour layovers due to FAR117. The LOA language became controversial after it did not meet the direction given and the pilots learned the details of the proposed language.

Why are you choosing to deliberately misrepresent the facts regarding the genesis of CDO language?

Are you really lending credibility to the DPA by citing their survey as a reason for including it in the ALPA survey ?

How can you cite the survey as scientific at this point after ATL and SLC biased the survey sample by offering suggestions (the implications thereof) on how to answer questions?

 

I normally agree with your arguments, but in this case, I will have to disagree. FDX and UPS both hire the same caliber of pilots that we do, and those companies do in fact compete with Delta for their services. Since that is the case, I believe a comparison between them and us is valid.

 

Tsquare, I know you don't want to hear this but I'm beginning to like Lane as Bama's OC.

 

I don't have anything against him actually. If Ed Orgeron got run over by a truck full of dead skunks it would be too good for him.


I still wonder what Tennessee did to the football gods to deserve the bad karma that we are getting in the form of Lane Kiffin.

 

Heath Shuler?

 

Fixed it for you.

Now hold on to your tin foil hat and focus.

The C20 reps ( I wonder who they were) were the first to argue in favor of CDOs by introducing a C20 resolution asking that the contract be modified to bring back "illegals." The C20 reps argued that they were very popular with senior pilots. But for the actions of other representatives we would have had CDOs years ago.

Now I'm not saying that the C20 resolution asking for CDOs, which was championed by the C20 reps, was the genesis of CDOs in the FAR117 TA, not at all. What I am saying is that there was pilot input in favor of CDOs.

There has also been pilot input against CDOs in the form of emails to reps.

There are also a significant number of pilots who have expressed a desire for CDOs.

With all these conflicting data points, what's wrong with asking a straight forward question in a scientific survey?

 

And it appears to be 39 for and 61 against.

Done. Question answered.

Next.

 

Another question. Short call reserve. I know the contract says a reasonable amount of time to get to the airport and it is known that 2 hours is reasonable. Is the 2 hours for check in at the computer and then you have about an hour to push OR is it 2 hours from the time you get the phone call to your arse better be sitting in the seat of the airplane getting ready to push?

 

lol. Not sure how that applies, but it is as logical a reason as any.