Go Back  Airline Pilot Central Forums > Airline Pilot Forums > Major > Delta
Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta? >

Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?

Search

Notices

Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 05-17-2015 | 10:57 AM
  #182601  
Alan Shore's Avatar
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,299
Likes: 0
Default

Originally Posted by georgetg
...the discrepancy between reserves available and reserves required can even occur after all uncovered trips have been covered.
Not sure what you mean by discrepancy. Because Delta must staff by position, not category, one category within a position may be overstaffed while another is understaffed. That situation can lead to the reserves available being consistently less than reserves required throughout a bid period.
Old 05-17-2015 | 11:42 AM
  #182602  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 2,206
Likes: 0
From: DAL FO
Default

Originally Posted by Alan Shore
I did a spot check on a few NYC 717 B pilots for June. Although their PBS award puts them on call on July 1, they have not completed OE, which means that they are not, as of yet, on call on that date. The minute their last LCP marks them "OK," they will show as being on call on July 1, and the reserve available number on that date should increase accordingly.
It seems that you are describing how they are running it. The question I have posed, and am awaiting a response to, is where is Reserves Available defined?

23W defines Reserves Required, but nowhere (that I've been able to find) does it specify how the Available number is calculated. 23W mentions the Available number, but does not define it. I can't see anything that prohibits or allows them to not count a reserve pilot until he is marked OK - it seems to be an open interpretation.

As Mike pointed out, a pilot scheduled to finish OE on June 1st could be reasonably expected to be available at some point later in the month. If we aren't claiming credit for him, we are costing ourselves QOL in the form of schedule flexibility. This is happening in more categories than just NYC717B.

If [Reserves] Available is defined somewhere that a pilot must be marked OK before being counted, then fine. If not, I'm hoping to explore further and see if we can obtain a more pilot-friendly interpretation.
Old 05-17-2015 | 12:00 PM
  #182603  
New Hire
 
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 800
Likes: 6
From: Concourse A
Default

Originally Posted by MikeF16
NYC 717B

As stated earlier, the entire month shows mostly 5-8 required with 1 available. Makes no sense.
don't worry..a bunch of us will be done with 717 OE by the middle of June. Hopefully the staffing number will be correct around then for schedule enhancement
Old 05-17-2015 | 12:03 PM
  #182604  
Alan Shore's Avatar
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,299
Likes: 0
Default

Originally Posted by LeineLodge
...where is Reserves Available defined? 23W mentions the Available number, but does not define it. I can't see anything that prohibits or allows them to not count a reserve pilot until he is marked OK...
23 W. 1. a. defines A (reserves available) to be the number of reserve pilots scheduled to be on call in category for the entire day on D (the date in question). I agree that there is nothing in the language that allows them not to count a reserve pilot who has not completed his OE.
Old 05-17-2015 | 01:27 PM
  #182605  
georgetg's Avatar
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,724
Likes: 0
From: Boeing Hearing and Ergonomics Lab Rat, Night Shift
Default

Originally Posted by Alan Shore
Not sure what you mean by discrepancy. Because Delta must staff by position, not category, one category within a position may be overstaffed while another is understaffed. That situation can lead to the reserves available being consistently less than reserves required throughout a bid period.
No, the discrepancy is between the count of "how many guys are actually on reserve" in the Reserve Availability Screen in iCrew and the count of "how many guys are actually on reserve" on the Reserves Required Screen.

For example the Reserves Required Screen shows 5 reserves required and 2 available, yet for the same day 6 pilots are on short call.

The difference is that line holders can't PD or swap and reserves can't move x-days because the Reserves Required screen consistently undercounts actual reserves available...
This is all happening in same base on same equipment. This has nothing to do with category level staffing...

Cheers
George
Old 05-17-2015 | 02:03 PM
  #182606  
Alan Shore's Avatar
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,299
Likes: 0
Default

Originally Posted by georgetg
No, the discrepancy is between the count of "how many guys are actually on reserve" in the Reserve Availability Screen in iCrew and the count of "how many guys are actually on reserve" on the Reserves Required Screen.

For example the Reserves Required Screen shows 5 reserves required and 2 available, yet for the same day 6 pilots are on short call.
Now I'm with you. I believe the reason is that, to count as a "Reserve Available," a pilot must be on call for the entire day. A pilot who begins short call at noon is not on call the entire day, as he is at rest 0000-1200. Before he was assigned that short call, he was counted in Reserves Available, but once the short call and the requisite prior 12 hours' rest was put on his line, he was not.

OTOH, a pilot who carries a short call into a day from the previous day does count in that day's Reserves Available because he is on call, i.e., not at rest, for the entire day.
Old 05-17-2015 | 02:27 PM
  #182607  
forgot to bid's Avatar
veut gagner à la loterie
 
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 23,286
Likes: 0
From: Light Chop
Default

Originally Posted by LeineLodge
For the few guys that might actually live nearby it is for sure.

For anyone trying to commute/PD/Swap, not so much.

My contention is they should be counting anyone that is awarded RES on that day, whether they have finished OE yet or not. It is more than reasonable to assume that they will be out on the line by the time that date rolls around, unless they are on Shadow days.

Even if we spot them the Shadow days, that would still make the majority of the month positive (at least prior to the first PCS run) allowing for a little bit of QOL in categories affected by this issue.
I hear ya. My comment was tic. I saw that 2 day in nyc go out on a gs to atl, I don't get how an atl resident would be able to pull that off but I can say I've had friend on atl737 get next day 4 day GS in nyc. It is possible when staffing has collapsed.

I don't get the number either, but one thing I thought is if they show 5 required on Friday but there are 7 actually available is it because of trips that went out earlier in the week that would knock out 2 on Friday? I look at that number all the time and it fluctuates all the time. I don't know why.
Old 05-17-2015 | 05:17 PM
  #182608  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 2,206
Likes: 0
From: DAL FO
Default

FYI Projected Training/Conversion dates from the most recent AE are out

Deltanet->Crew Resources & Scheduling->Advanced Entitlements
Old 05-17-2015 | 08:14 PM
  #182609  
Dirtdiver's Avatar
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 791
Likes: 0
From: 767A
Default

Originally Posted by Alan Shore
Now I'm with you. I believe the reason is that, to count as a "Reserve Available," a pilot must be on call for the entire day. A pilot who begins short call at noon is not on call the entire day, as he is at rest 0000-1200. Before he was assigned that short call, he was counted in Reserves Available, but once the short call and the requisite prior 12 hours' rest was put on his line, he was not.

OTOH, a pilot who carries a short call into a day from the previous day does count in that day's Reserves Available because he is on call, i.e., not at rest, for the entire day.
In practice, it appears they knock one off the avail list for every one they project to actually use. The numbers just don't add up
Old 05-17-2015 | 08:38 PM
  #182610  
forgot to bid's Avatar
veut gagner à la loterie
 
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 23,286
Likes: 0
From: Light Chop
Default

Originally Posted by Dirtdiver
In practice, it appears they knock one off the avail list for every one they project to actually use. The numbers just don't add up
Could WSs play a factor in the calculation? Doesn't make sense I know, but nobody is saying the numbers make sense to begin with.
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
On Autopilot
Regional
22617
11-05-2021 07:03 AM
AeroCrewSolut
Delta
153
08-14-2018 12:18 PM
Bill Lumberg
Major
71
06-13-2012 08:36 AM
Quagmire
Major
253
04-16-2011 06:19 AM
JiffyLube
Major
12
03-07-2008 04:27 PM

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



Your Privacy Choices