Limited in its current form, basically assisting in payment for a funeral. I'm not against improving the survivor benefit at all (it's not one of my personal highest priorities, however), but anything that we expend negotiating capital on can't be a promise to pay, in my view. It must be funded in our name and portable.

The change from a DB plan to a DC plan has some advantages for our survivors. Under our old pension we had to buy the survivor annuity if you wanted 50% of your non-lump pension benefit to continue to be paid, and it was very expensive insurance. The pension survivor benefit plus the D&S survivor benefit essentially kept your survivors in the same income stream. If you died without the pension survivor benefit, only the D&S benefit was paid, essentially cutting the income stream in half. When the pension failed, there were survivors that lost just like retirees. That's similar to the risk of an annuity funded through the D&S that isn't in your name, and it would have even fewer ERISA protections.

Under a DC plan, whatever money you have survives you. Those that have a PBGC benefit (again expensive) can purchase the survivor option should they want to protect 50% of your survivor's PBGC annuity stream.

I agree. Unfortunately, Section 1114 of the bankruptcy code doesn't. I've got the 1113 t-shirt, I don't need another court approved one.:eek:

Man, it's getting cold down here! Is that ice? Something's freezing over!:D

This wins the understatement of the night... no.. of the century.

All of the above happened in bankruptcy court. Do you expect that to happen again? What is the money in the D&S plan for if not for disability AND survivorship. What is all that money really doing for us now (beyond the disability part)?

I should also add it's funding the first 60 million dollars of our sick leave too! :rolleyes:
Denny

I totally agree.

Alright...who the hell is hacking into slowplay's account?

Carl

Nice! That little gem must have been written by the same scope lawyers that couldn't think of the RAH separate certificate trick several years after RAH's scope lawyers already thought of it. So we pulldown to fund their A-380 fantasy jobs program while they hide capacity by subcontracting it? We seriously fell for that?

From the numbers we are well outside of the 50/50% balance

If I read it right the window triples in length before our flying needs to be adjusted up based on lookback. That a pretty long wait...
I wonder how that extension is supposed to be benefitial to current Delta pilots. Seems like the company would want that if someone else were to be added to the Euro side of the JV....

Cheers
George

Question, a buddy called me with the understanding that some CP's are saying hiring of 300-500 pilots in 2012.

I could see that for retiree's, not 2012 retiree's but retiree's in the future and of course if they want to be 2013 is a better year but they won't know enough to make that bet until 2012.

At this point I could completely care less. Until it's announced. Tired of rumors of airplanes, hiring and growth, few of which come true. But for the sake of those from the outside looking in, anyone else hearing that?

fixed it for ya... but I agree with the rumor mongering.

Isn't that sad?

Here we are at "The latest and greatest about Delta" and all its about is speculating about hiring for attrition maybe 2 years from now...

I better keep my mouth shut, else I'll get lectured again
"You should be lucky to have a job, look at the situation at American..."

The reality is probably more along the lines of: Delta was a first mover in the big consolidation game and now needs to wait its turn until the other players have executed their moves. In the meantime it will be status-qou while the company grows virtually via our partners, JV and otherwise...

Cheers
George