Details on Delta TA
09-23-2014 | 10:51 AM
#2151
Runs with scissors
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 7,847
Likes: 0
From: Going to hell in a bucket, but enjoying the ride .
You don't need to answer for other people, that's my only point.
Have you done any accounting on your own, as far as how much money YOU have contributed to Delta's record earnings so far?
09-23-2014 | 10:55 AM
#2152
At home on the maddog!
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 2,874
Likes: 0
From: Retired (mandatory age 65)
I've got a strategy to achieve Restoration:
1. Post a full financial accounting of the BILLIONS of dollars, yearly, since we took a 42% pay cut. Then chart that vs. today's earnings, and vs. Management's pay for the same 10 years past.
2. Track those dollars, vs. Delta's profits and debt reductions.
3. Account for the lost DB money, and non-funding of the Delta Pilot's DB going forward, vs. our DC plan money.
4. Start putting together info and videos from the Negotiating Committee about how much money the Delta Pilots have contributed over the past 10 years, to Save Delta. And where did the money come from for the Stock Buybacks and Dividends? Oh...yeah...from US!
What pizzes me and a lot of other Senior pilots off is, DALPA won't even MENTION the word, Restoration, never mind show the math on HOW MUCH MONEY the Pilots alone have been contributing to Delta's Record Earnings now, and for the past 10 years! And how much money our DC plan saves them, vs. our old DB plan, and crank up the Family Awareness meetings to get the troops riled up.
I'm not saying I want the DB plan reinstated, but I sure would LOVE to see the difference for the company funding that, vs. contributing 14% of pay rates that are still below 2001 levels. They are still on the hook for Billions in NW's Frozen DB pension liabilities, but they flushed the Delta (south) pilot's down the toilet. Where's the accounting for that?
5. Go to Wall Street and start telling them that before the next Billion Dollar Stock Buyback, or Billion in Dividends is distributed, the Biggest INVESTORS, who SAVED DELTA, want to be REPAID!! NOW!! And if we are NOT repaid, sh!t is going to start happening which WILL impact earnings.
Do any of you remember how we got our C2K pay rates in the first place???
Here's a hint; the MEC beat the RESTORATION drum loudly, for many months.
But this time around....
Complete silence, like the biggest pay and benefit cuts in the history of the industry, NEVER HAPPENED, all while the 3 Majors are now posting the highest earnings in the history of the industry!!
W. T. F. is WRONG with these MEC guys?
No goals, no plans, no strategy, NOTHING!
Fill out your survey....?
REALLY?
You mean to tell me they FORGOT what we gave up?
Or they 'lost' the 2012 surveys?
You wonder why DPA even exists?
That's why!
Without "Labor Risk", what do we have?
4-8-3-3.
1. Post a full financial accounting of the BILLIONS of dollars, yearly, since we took a 42% pay cut. Then chart that vs. today's earnings, and vs. Management's pay for the same 10 years past.
2. Track those dollars, vs. Delta's profits and debt reductions.
3. Account for the lost DB money, and non-funding of the Delta Pilot's DB going forward, vs. our DC plan money.
4. Start putting together info and videos from the Negotiating Committee about how much money the Delta Pilots have contributed over the past 10 years, to Save Delta. And where did the money come from for the Stock Buybacks and Dividends? Oh...yeah...from US!
What pizzes me and a lot of other Senior pilots off is, DALPA won't even MENTION the word, Restoration, never mind show the math on HOW MUCH MONEY the Pilots alone have been contributing to Delta's Record Earnings now, and for the past 10 years! And how much money our DC plan saves them, vs. our old DB plan, and crank up the Family Awareness meetings to get the troops riled up.
I'm not saying I want the DB plan reinstated, but I sure would LOVE to see the difference for the company funding that, vs. contributing 14% of pay rates that are still below 2001 levels. They are still on the hook for Billions in NW's Frozen DB pension liabilities, but they flushed the Delta (south) pilot's down the toilet. Where's the accounting for that?
5. Go to Wall Street and start telling them that before the next Billion Dollar Stock Buyback, or Billion in Dividends is distributed, the Biggest INVESTORS, who SAVED DELTA, want to be REPAID!! NOW!! And if we are NOT repaid, sh!t is going to start happening which WILL impact earnings.
Do any of you remember how we got our C2K pay rates in the first place???
Here's a hint; the MEC beat the RESTORATION drum loudly, for many months.
But this time around....
Complete silence, like the biggest pay and benefit cuts in the history of the industry, NEVER HAPPENED, all while the 3 Majors are now posting the highest earnings in the history of the industry!!
W. T. F. is WRONG with these MEC guys?
No goals, no plans, no strategy, NOTHING!
Fill out your survey....?
REALLY?
You mean to tell me they FORGOT what we gave up?
Or they 'lost' the 2012 surveys?
You wonder why DPA even exists?
That's why!
Without "Labor Risk", what do we have?
4-8-3-3.
I nominate this post for "post of the year." Absolutely spot on, Timbo!
09-23-2014 | 11:57 AM
#2153
Line Holder
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 972
Likes: 1
From: 7ERA
Yes, I have done some back of the napkin math on what could have been, but that was at least 3 years ago. For me it gets more and more difficult to compare the further out we go, as there are some things now that are significantly better for me than they were under C2k. The differences don't always translate well for me when trying to make a straight up comparison, but that's just me and my scenario. In my opinion, every pilot's situation is unique in making that comparison.
09-23-2014 | 12:23 PM
#2154
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 463
Likes: 0
I've got a strategy to achieve Restoration:
1. Post a full financial accounting of the BILLIONS of dollars, yearly, since we took a 42% pay cut. Then chart that vs. today's earnings, and vs. Management's pay for the same 10 years past.
2. Track those dollars, vs. Delta's profits and debt reductions.
3. Account for the lost DB money, and non-funding of the Delta Pilot's DB going forward, vs. our DC plan money.
4. Start putting together info and videos from the Negotiating Committee about how much money the Delta Pilots have contributed over the past 10 years, to Save Delta. And where did the money come from for the Stock Buybacks and Dividends? Oh...yeah...from US!
What pizzes me and a lot of other Senior pilots off is, DALPA won't even MENTION the word, Restoration, never mind show the math on HOW MUCH MONEY the Pilots alone have been contributing to Delta's Record Earnings now, and for the past 10 years! And how much money our DC plan saves them, vs. our old DB plan, and crank up the Family Awareness meetings to get the troops riled up.
I'm not saying I want the DB plan reinstated, but I sure would LOVE to see the difference for the company funding that, vs. contributing 14% of pay rates that are still below 2001 levels. They are still on the hook for Billions in NW's Frozen DB pension liabilities, but they flushed the Delta (south) pilot's down the toilet. Where's the accounting for that?
5. Go to Wall Street and start telling them that before the next Billion Dollar Stock Buyback, or Billion in Dividends is distributed, the Biggest INVESTORS, who SAVED DELTA, want to be REPAID!! NOW!! And if we are NOT repaid, sh!t is going to start happening which WILL impact earnings.
Do any of you remember how we got our C2K pay rates in the first place???
Here's a hint; the MEC beat the RESTORATION drum loudly, for many months.
But this time around....
Complete silence, like the biggest pay and benefit cuts in the history of the industry, NEVER HAPPENED, all while the 3 Majors are now posting the highest earnings in the history of the industry!!
W. T. F. is WRONG with these MEC guys?
No goals, no plans, no strategy, NOTHING!
Fill out your survey....?
REALLY?
You mean to tell me they FORGOT what we gave up?
Or they 'lost' the 2012 surveys?
You wonder why DPA even exists?
That's why!
Without "Labor Risk", what do we have?
4-8-3-3.
1. Post a full financial accounting of the BILLIONS of dollars, yearly, since we took a 42% pay cut. Then chart that vs. today's earnings, and vs. Management's pay for the same 10 years past.
2. Track those dollars, vs. Delta's profits and debt reductions.
3. Account for the lost DB money, and non-funding of the Delta Pilot's DB going forward, vs. our DC plan money.
4. Start putting together info and videos from the Negotiating Committee about how much money the Delta Pilots have contributed over the past 10 years, to Save Delta. And where did the money come from for the Stock Buybacks and Dividends? Oh...yeah...from US!
What pizzes me and a lot of other Senior pilots off is, DALPA won't even MENTION the word, Restoration, never mind show the math on HOW MUCH MONEY the Pilots alone have been contributing to Delta's Record Earnings now, and for the past 10 years! And how much money our DC plan saves them, vs. our old DB plan, and crank up the Family Awareness meetings to get the troops riled up.
I'm not saying I want the DB plan reinstated, but I sure would LOVE to see the difference for the company funding that, vs. contributing 14% of pay rates that are still below 2001 levels. They are still on the hook for Billions in NW's Frozen DB pension liabilities, but they flushed the Delta (south) pilot's down the toilet. Where's the accounting for that?
5. Go to Wall Street and start telling them that before the next Billion Dollar Stock Buyback, or Billion in Dividends is distributed, the Biggest INVESTORS, who SAVED DELTA, want to be REPAID!! NOW!! And if we are NOT repaid, sh!t is going to start happening which WILL impact earnings.
Do any of you remember how we got our C2K pay rates in the first place???
Here's a hint; the MEC beat the RESTORATION drum loudly, for many months.
But this time around....
Complete silence, like the biggest pay and benefit cuts in the history of the industry, NEVER HAPPENED, all while the 3 Majors are now posting the highest earnings in the history of the industry!!
W. T. F. is WRONG with these MEC guys?
No goals, no plans, no strategy, NOTHING!
Fill out your survey....?
REALLY?
You mean to tell me they FORGOT what we gave up?
Or they 'lost' the 2012 surveys?
You wonder why DPA even exists?
That's why!
Without "Labor Risk", what do we have?
4-8-3-3.
On a related note...
Airline profits up 64%, bag fees generate $900 million in 2nd quarter - Chicago Tribune
09-23-2014 | 12:49 PM
#2155
Runs with scissors
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 7,847
Likes: 0
From: Going to hell in a bucket, but enjoying the ride .
From the article (and thanks for posting that Ed):
Airline industry experts attribute the strong financial numbers to carriers filling almost every available seat and collecting fees for a long menu of on-board extras. In June, 87.4% of the seats on domestic flights were full, a new record for the industry.
The nation's largest airlines collected $3.3 billion in checked bag fees for 2013, compared with $1.1 billion in 2008.
Once the merger of American Airlines and US Airways is completed, four of the nation's carriers will control about 80% of all domestic air traffic, according to federal studies.
Time for some Restoration!
Airline industry experts attribute the strong financial numbers to carriers filling almost every available seat and collecting fees for a long menu of on-board extras. In June, 87.4% of the seats on domestic flights were full, a new record for the industry.
The nation's largest airlines collected $3.3 billion in checked bag fees for 2013, compared with $1.1 billion in 2008.
Once the merger of American Airlines and US Airways is completed, four of the nation's carriers will control about 80% of all domestic air traffic, according to federal studies.
Time for some Restoration!
09-23-2014 | 12:54 PM
#2156
Wind the clock beoch
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 437
Likes: 0
I've got a strategy to achieve Restoration:
1. Post a full financial accounting of the BILLIONS of dollars, yearly, since we took a 42% pay cut. Then chart that vs. today's earnings, and vs. Management's pay for the same 10 years past.
2. Track those dollars, vs. Delta's profits and debt reductions.
3. Account for the lost DB money, and non-funding of the Delta Pilot's DB going forward, vs. our DC plan money.
4. Start putting together info and videos from the Negotiating Committee about how much money the Delta Pilots have contributed over the past 10 years, to Save Delta. And where did the money come from for the Stock Buybacks and Dividends? Oh...yeah...from US!
What pizzes me and a lot of other Senior pilots off is, DALPA won't even MENTION the word, Restoration, never mind show the math on HOW MUCH MONEY the Pilots alone have been contributing to Delta's Record Earnings now, and for the past 10 years! And how much money our DC plan saves them, vs. our old DB plan, and crank up the Family Awareness meetings to get the troops riled up.
I'm not saying I want the DB plan reinstated, but I sure would LOVE to see the difference for the company funding that, vs. contributing 14% of pay rates that are still below 2001 levels. They are still on the hook for Billions in NW's Frozen DB pension liabilities, but they flushed the Delta (south) pilot's down the toilet. Where's the accounting for that?
5. Go to Wall Street and start telling them that before the next Billion Dollar Stock Buyback, or Billion in Dividends is distributed, the Biggest INVESTORS, who SAVED DELTA, want to be REPAID!! NOW!! And if we are NOT repaid, sh!t is going to start happening which WILL impact earnings.
Do any of you remember how we got our C2K pay rates in the first place???
Here's a hint; the MEC beat the RESTORATION drum loudly, for many months.
But this time around....
Complete silence, like the biggest pay and benefit cuts in the history of the industry, NEVER HAPPENED, all while the 3 Majors are now posting the highest earnings in the history of the industry!!
W. T. F. is WRONG with these MEC guys?
No goals, no plans, no strategy, NOTHING!
Fill out your survey....?
REALLY?
You mean to tell me they FORGOT what we gave up?
Or they 'lost' the 2012 surveys?
You wonder why DPA even exists?
That's why!
Without "Labor Risk", what do we have?
4-8-3-3.
1. Post a full financial accounting of the BILLIONS of dollars, yearly, since we took a 42% pay cut. Then chart that vs. today's earnings, and vs. Management's pay for the same 10 years past.
2. Track those dollars, vs. Delta's profits and debt reductions.
3. Account for the lost DB money, and non-funding of the Delta Pilot's DB going forward, vs. our DC plan money.
4. Start putting together info and videos from the Negotiating Committee about how much money the Delta Pilots have contributed over the past 10 years, to Save Delta. And where did the money come from for the Stock Buybacks and Dividends? Oh...yeah...from US!
What pizzes me and a lot of other Senior pilots off is, DALPA won't even MENTION the word, Restoration, never mind show the math on HOW MUCH MONEY the Pilots alone have been contributing to Delta's Record Earnings now, and for the past 10 years! And how much money our DC plan saves them, vs. our old DB plan, and crank up the Family Awareness meetings to get the troops riled up.
I'm not saying I want the DB plan reinstated, but I sure would LOVE to see the difference for the company funding that, vs. contributing 14% of pay rates that are still below 2001 levels. They are still on the hook for Billions in NW's Frozen DB pension liabilities, but they flushed the Delta (south) pilot's down the toilet. Where's the accounting for that?
5. Go to Wall Street and start telling them that before the next Billion Dollar Stock Buyback, or Billion in Dividends is distributed, the Biggest INVESTORS, who SAVED DELTA, want to be REPAID!! NOW!! And if we are NOT repaid, sh!t is going to start happening which WILL impact earnings.
Do any of you remember how we got our C2K pay rates in the first place???
Here's a hint; the MEC beat the RESTORATION drum loudly, for many months.
But this time around....
Complete silence, like the biggest pay and benefit cuts in the history of the industry, NEVER HAPPENED, all while the 3 Majors are now posting the highest earnings in the history of the industry!!
W. T. F. is WRONG with these MEC guys?
No goals, no plans, no strategy, NOTHING!
Fill out your survey....?
REALLY?
You mean to tell me they FORGOT what we gave up?
Or they 'lost' the 2012 surveys?
You wonder why DPA even exists?
That's why!
Without "Labor Risk", what do we have?
4-8-3-3.
Phenomenal post! Very well stated. Hands down the post of the year.
Unfortunately, there is absolutely ZERO chance the MEC will adopt such a strategy.
Peace in our time is the "strategy" du jour. Yeah, right.
09-23-2014 | 01:18 PM
#2157
Runs with scissors
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 7,847
Likes: 0
From: Going to hell in a bucket, but enjoying the ride .
Well when the ALPA National President is talking about our (bankruptcy inspired) contracts being "Mature" and there won't be any labor risk, I've got to wonder where he's going next. I seriously doubt he'll return to the line to fly (and be paid) what he can hold, and work under the contract he helped put in place.
Why has there been zero pushback from MD about Richard's "Labor Risk has been taken off the table" statement, and where is the retraction from LM about his statements about our Mature contracts?
Who the FK do these clowns think they work for? Richard??
Why has there been zero pushback from MD about Richard's "Labor Risk has been taken off the table" statement, and where is the retraction from LM about his statements about our Mature contracts?
Who the FK do these clowns think they work for? Richard??
09-23-2014 | 02:48 PM
#2159
Line Holder
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,688
Likes: 66
DALPA is concerned about what the other employees would think. Can't recall how many times I've heard this uttered. My answer is, and always will be, Who f'n cares.
Well when the ALPA National President is talking about our (bankruptcy inspired) contracts being "Mature" and there won't be any labor risk, I've got to wonder where he's going next. I seriously doubt he'll return to the line to fly (and be paid) what he can hold, and work under the contract he helped put in place.
Why has there been zero pushback from MD about Richard's "Labor Risk has been taken off the table" statement, and where is the retraction from LM about his statements about our Mature contracts?
Who the FK do these clowns think they work for? Richard??
Why has there been zero pushback from MD about Richard's "Labor Risk has been taken off the table" statement, and where is the retraction from LM about his statements about our Mature contracts?
Who the FK do these clowns think they work for? Richard??
09-23-2014 | 04:10 PM
#2160
Back on TDY
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 12,487
Likes: 0
From: 747-400 Captain
I've got a strategy to achieve Restoration:
1. Post a full financial accounting of the BILLIONS of dollars, yearly, since we took a 42% pay cut. Then chart that vs. today's earnings, and vs. Management's pay for the same 10 years past.
2. Track those dollars, vs. Delta's profits and debt reductions.
3. Account for the lost DB money, and non-funding of the Delta Pilot's DB going forward, vs. our DC plan money.
4. Start putting together info and videos from the Negotiating Committee about how much money the Delta Pilots have contributed over the past 10 years, to Save Delta. And where did the money come from for the Stock Buybacks and Dividends? Oh...yeah...from US!
What pizzes me and a lot of other Senior pilots off is, DALPA won't even MENTION the word, Restoration, never mind show the math on HOW MUCH MONEY the Pilots alone have been contributing to Delta's Record Earnings now, and for the past 10 years! And how much money our DC plan saves them, vs. our old DB plan, and crank up the Family Awareness meetings to get the troops riled up.
I'm not saying I want the DB plan reinstated, but I sure would LOVE to see the difference for the company funding that, vs. contributing 14% of pay rates that are still below 2001 levels. They are still on the hook for Billions in NW's Frozen DB pension liabilities, but they flushed the Delta (south) pilot's down the toilet. Where's the accounting for that?
5. Go to Wall Street and start telling them that before the next Billion Dollar Stock Buyback, or Billion in Dividends is distributed, the Biggest INVESTORS, who SAVED DELTA, want to be REPAID!! NOW!! And if we are NOT repaid, sh!t is going to start happening which WILL impact earnings.
Do any of you remember how we got our C2K pay rates in the first place???
Here's a hint; the MEC beat the RESTORATION drum loudly, for many months.
But this time around....
Complete silence, like the biggest pay and benefit cuts in the history of the industry, NEVER HAPPENED, all while the 3 Majors are now posting the highest earnings in the history of the industry!!
W. T. F. is WRONG with these MEC guys?
No goals, no plans, no strategy, NOTHING!
Fill out your survey....?
REALLY?
You mean to tell me they FORGOT what we gave up?
Or they 'lost' the 2012 surveys?
You wonder why DPA even exists?
That's why!
Without "Labor Risk", what do we have?
4-8-3-3.
1. Post a full financial accounting of the BILLIONS of dollars, yearly, since we took a 42% pay cut. Then chart that vs. today's earnings, and vs. Management's pay for the same 10 years past.
2. Track those dollars, vs. Delta's profits and debt reductions.
3. Account for the lost DB money, and non-funding of the Delta Pilot's DB going forward, vs. our DC plan money.
4. Start putting together info and videos from the Negotiating Committee about how much money the Delta Pilots have contributed over the past 10 years, to Save Delta. And where did the money come from for the Stock Buybacks and Dividends? Oh...yeah...from US!
What pizzes me and a lot of other Senior pilots off is, DALPA won't even MENTION the word, Restoration, never mind show the math on HOW MUCH MONEY the Pilots alone have been contributing to Delta's Record Earnings now, and for the past 10 years! And how much money our DC plan saves them, vs. our old DB plan, and crank up the Family Awareness meetings to get the troops riled up.
I'm not saying I want the DB plan reinstated, but I sure would LOVE to see the difference for the company funding that, vs. contributing 14% of pay rates that are still below 2001 levels. They are still on the hook for Billions in NW's Frozen DB pension liabilities, but they flushed the Delta (south) pilot's down the toilet. Where's the accounting for that?
5. Go to Wall Street and start telling them that before the next Billion Dollar Stock Buyback, or Billion in Dividends is distributed, the Biggest INVESTORS, who SAVED DELTA, want to be REPAID!! NOW!! And if we are NOT repaid, sh!t is going to start happening which WILL impact earnings.
Do any of you remember how we got our C2K pay rates in the first place???
Here's a hint; the MEC beat the RESTORATION drum loudly, for many months.
But this time around....
Complete silence, like the biggest pay and benefit cuts in the history of the industry, NEVER HAPPENED, all while the 3 Majors are now posting the highest earnings in the history of the industry!!
W. T. F. is WRONG with these MEC guys?
No goals, no plans, no strategy, NOTHING!
Fill out your survey....?
REALLY?
You mean to tell me they FORGOT what we gave up?
Or they 'lost' the 2012 surveys?
You wonder why DPA even exists?
That's why!
Without "Labor Risk", what do we have?
4-8-3-3.
As happy as I am about this post from Timbo, I'm even happier about him inviting me to go sailing.
Carl
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