Originally Posted by SharpestTool (Post 1898095)

So you're going to guarantee that another 2008 or 9/11 isn't going to happen in the next 3 years? Seriously? Or the current cycle that is going on 8 years isn't going to reverse. Wow!

Originally Posted by forgot to bid (Post 1898180)

It's a goal post shift because the TA is here.

Now it must be passed by the MEC. Next, it must be passed by the pilots. Anything less and we lose all credibility or something.

Originally Posted by Denny Crane (Post 1898170)

1. The MEC sends the NC back in and says get a better deal we don't care how long it takes.

2. The NC is fired/resigns and a new NC is sent back in to get a better deal.

3. The MEC admin and NC are fired/resign and new ones are elected and sent back in.

What is wrong with any of these scenarios? Time is on our side. Why settle for a mediocre agreement in this negotiating environment? Why can we not follow the footprint of Contract 2001 negotiations? It was a great negotiating environment too.

Denny

PS. I wasn't going to start getting involved in the contract questions until Tuesday but by then it will be too late to respond.

Originally Posted by SharpestTool (Post 1898159)

It means they don't want to waste their time negotiating with a MEC that is either disingenuous at the table or cannot deliver what they say they can.

Originally Posted by newKnow (Post 1898171)

Part 1:

American union pulls out of deal, bankruptcy possible - Apr. 19, 2003

American union pulls out of deal
Flight attendants will vote again on concessions to avoid bankruptcy due to outcry over exec pay.
April 19, 2003: 1:58 PM EDT
By Chris Isidore, CNN/Money Senior Writer

NEW YORK (CNN/Money) - American Airlines' flight attendants union announced it would hold a new vote on $340 million in annual concessions due to outcry over a compensation plan for the airline's management, a move that could force the world's largest airline into bankruptcy.

The rank-and-file members of the Association of Professional Flight Attendants initially rejected the cost-cutting six-year pact Tuesday by a 51 to 49 percent margin, then the next day approved the pact by a 53-47 percent vote at the strong urging of union leadership. But both votes took place before the compensation packages for management were widely known. The union leadership said compensation plans for American's best paid executives were "morally bankrupt" and demanded another vote of members.

American Airlines, the world's largest airline, faces a new bankruptcy threat due to union outcry over its executive compensation plans.

"This taints the agreement that was ratified just two days ago in a wrenching process for our members," said a letter from APFA President John Ward late Friday night. "Every APFA member - those who voted for the agreement and those who voted against it - are outraged by this action, as am I."

American Airlines had said that it needed the concession contracts with the flight attendants and the other two unions approved by this past Wednesday at the latest or it would be forced to immediately file for bankruptcy court protections. Its spokesmen would not take questions on the APFA threat of holding a new vote.

"American has a valid ratified agreement with the APFA," was the only statement from American spokesman Gus Whitcomb.

There was no immediate word from two other unions - the Allied Pilots Association and the Transport Workers Union, which represents most American ground workers - on their plans to go forward with more than $600 million each in annual wage concessions approved this past Tuesday.....

Originally Posted by Ferd149 (Post 1898188)

Looks like my my lawyer, the great Denny Crane, speaks for me. Well said.

Ill wait to see what comes out Tuesday. I hope we didn't just rearrange the deck chairs.

As far as the sick leave rumor, that looks like they are calling us liars.

Originally Posted by Denny Crane (Post 1898195)

Thanks Ferd! I was trying to wait too but........

As far as sick leave rumor goes, I agree with you.

I consider you and I typical line pilots. I don't remember how you voted on C2012 but I voted for it. It was a very hard decision but because of the whole deal, I did vote for it. For C2015, in the present negotiating environment, I can accept nothing but a clear win for the pilot group. The "clear win" is obviously subjective. I can't tell you what it is but I will know it when I see............just like a beautiful woman!

Shirley..............is that you!?!:)

Denny

Originally Posted by SharpestTool (Post 1898131)

Fine. Don't use history solely. How about using some of it? You need to study this business. It ain't the military. I'll save you time though, but you'll have to trust me. I've been in this business for nearly 22 years and nobody has pulled off the trick yet. Bait and switch does not work.

Originally Posted by Ferd149 (Post 1898200)

I was disappointed in the raise rates, but I voted for C12. I had several reasons for voting yes, some worked out some didn't...like life in general I guess:D


But, I guess this time I don't want to be disappointed. I agree, I'll know it when I see it:p

Ferd