Americans payrates are published on this website. They are bundled pay rates making direct comparisons difficult. On average however they are currently 7% above us. That will go to 10% next year. Some aircraft are more and others less. I think the M88 and A330 would need the biggest bump based on how AMR bundled. On the other hand our 717 rate is 20% plus higher then their 100 seat bundle.

How many seats on a 717?

Our existing pay rates for that are entirely and radically unacceptable. We'd need JB's E190 rates plus a SIGNIFICANT premium. And no concessions to "buy" them either.

How many aircraft are they operating that fit into the 100 seat bundle?

Seats go my max certifiable not what management chooses to install. AirTran had 117 seats and even that was with a first class. So its really a 120-something seater easy.

Nothing other than connecting some dots.

You had my interest peaked until profit sharing concessions.

Keep Calm and Profit Share On

That is a bad term because it's too easy confuse. Let's just go with Donutelli's other description of this: "The World's Greatest Pilot Contract."

Carl

Fixed it for ya tsquare.

Carl

Your friends either do not work for Emirates or they are liars. Sorry to be blunt, but you'll need to provide specifics to back up your claims. I highly doubt that you'll be able to do so. As Skyone said. At Emirates anyway, it's not uncommon to have 40 and 50 year old flight attendants who have been at the airline for 20+ years. The average age is significantly lower than a U.S. or European carrier's crew, but not what you are stating.

.......and in other news from the Washington Post:


By Ashley Halsey III June 4 at 10:07 PM 


For months the battle lines have seemed clear, and dozens of lawmakers, mayors, unions and business types have joined in support as the three major U.S. airlines seek to stave off a bold challenge from competitors operating out of tiny Middle Eastern countries.

It was the United States vs. two Persian Gulf nations, with the Obama administration being pulled like taffy between them.

The dynamic changed dramatically last week when another big player entered the fray. FedEx, a U.S. company that flies 660 cargo planes worldwide, warned the White House that any action it took could be interpreted as “the cold wind of U.S. protectionism.”

FedEx, which is expanding a major hub operation in Dubai, home base of one of the gulf airlines, told federal regulators that “we would potentially be subject to the greatest harm” if the United States moves against its gulf competitors.

“We just don’t see how we could be kept out of the potential crossfire, even if it was not the intent of the Big 3 [U.S. airlines] to involve us,” FedEx Managing Director Nancy S. Sparks wrote in a formal filing to the U.S. Department of Transportation.


Two other key U.S. players with skin in the game have been more circumspect in responding to the desire of Delta, United and American airlines to have the government intercede in their battle for international dominance with Etihad and Emirates, both based in the United Arab Emirates, and Qatar airlines.

United Parcel Service says it is working to protect its interests “but also maintain our long-standing position on fair and transparent competition.” Boeing, which has sold billions of dollars in planes to the gulf carriers and has billions more on order, says, “We’ll let the [U.S.] carriers speak for themselves. We’re in no position to make judgments about these competitive issues.”

The issue at hand is fairness. The U.S. airlines, now merged into three big carriers that fly globally, are saddled with a stale domestic market and need international growth to expand. They’ve built that worldwide reach by expanding their operations and through code-sharing deals with airlines from other countries.

That growth faces a major threat from the three gulf carriers, whose rapid growth into international behemoths suggests they intend to control a huge slice of the global aviation pie.

The U.S. airlines say their competition is unfair because all three gulf airlines are government-owned and, the U.S. carriers contend, have received $42 billion in subsidies from their governments. The U.S. carriers say they cannot compete against such subsidies.


The gulf airlines have not opened their books to scrutiny, but they say that their governments are investors that expect a return on their money.


The U.S. airlines want the White House to invoke the Open Skies agreements under which international flights operate, seeking a formal consultation. They hope the gulf carriers will freeze their flights to the United States while talks are underway, although Qatar Airways recently announced plans to expand its flights to the United States.

“The gulf carriers’ abuse of our Open Skies agreements is a matter that involves passenger airlines, not cargo carriers,” said Jill Zuckman, spokeswoman for the coalition of U.S. carriers. “Furthermore, it is hypocritical for FedEx to demand that the U.S. government include provisions in trade agreements to protect it from subsidized foreign competition, but take the opposite position when it affects others.”

Zuckman’s reference was to a 2012 case in which FedEx argued that the U.S. government should establish a “level playing field” for cargo and prohibit state-owned foreign enterprises from “cross-subsidizing” FedEx’s competitors.

The Obama administration has not called for consultations with Qatar or the United Arab Emirates, both key allies in the Middle East, and an administration official weighing whether to intercede said last month that any unilateral action by the United States would be “a major breach of the Open Skies agreements.”

FedEx, in its 11-page filing, argues strenuously against any U.S. action.

The cargo company says U.S. airlines exploited the Open Skies agreements to build their international network with code sharing and eliminating competitors by banding with foreign airlines. But now, FedEx contends, they are “making it appear that U.S. international aviation policy must be formulated first and foremost to secure U.S. airlines’ profits.”

“In this case, we believe the consumers should be allowed to be the winners,” Sparks wrote, an allusion to the belief that competition from gulf carriers may bring about lower ticket prices in the near term.

Open Skies agreements with more than 100 nations allow equal access to one another’s airports without interference from the respective national governments. FedEx argues that access to the three mega-airports that have been built in Qatar, Dubai and Abu Dhabi doesn’t matter much to the U.S. airlines. But it is important to FedEx, which sends 44 flights through Dubai each week.

“Only two of the Big 3 [U.S. airlines] even operate to the Gulf, and those two (Delta and United) each only operate a single bilateral flight each day,” Sparks wrote, adding that it, “is important to note that the Gulf carriers compete vigorously with FedEx in the air cargo arena.”



TP