Details on Delta TA
06-10-2015 | 05:48 PM
#7531
Line Holder
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 93
Likes: 0
I find this TA very motivating. It motivated me to email my ALPA reps several times pleading with them to vote no. (thank you NY reps, I think). It also motivated me to sign up for this forum and not just lurk. And if Caplinger wasn't such a tool it would motivate me to renew my DPA card. This last item is probably the most positive statement I will say about the TA.
06-10-2015 | 05:50 PM
#7532
Back on TDY
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 12,487
Likes: 0
From: 747-400 Captain
Guys, feel free to fill out a DPA card and even donate, but that won't cut it in the short term. We have to be thinking 5 moves ahead on this chess board, and our biggest threat right now is the TA's scope where we change from EASK's to Block Hours. If this passes, we had better be really sweet to management because that'll be our only hope. They could buy extended range Cessna 172's (used of course) to fly those Euro routes and be in FULL COMPLIANCE with this new scope...because it's about block hours now - not EASK's.
So first things first. First, recall as many of the YES voting reps as possible. Second, new MEC purges MEC administration of every elected chairman...and probably most of the admin members as well. Third, have the new MEC administration publish a proper fact-based pro/con paper on this TA. Fourth, membership will absolutely vote it down if given unbiased analysis. Fifth, offer new negotiations to begin immediately, secure in the fact that for the first time, foot dragging HELPS us and HURTS management.
Spending any energy on alternative unions before we do the above is putting the cart before the horse. If this new TA passes, DPA or DALPA will not be able to help. Management will hold all the cards. If you're too mean to them, they'll equipment sub Europe to the C172-ER's and remove blocks from F/O's...all without violating our contract.
Carl
So first things first. First, recall as many of the YES voting reps as possible. Second, new MEC purges MEC administration of every elected chairman...and probably most of the admin members as well. Third, have the new MEC administration publish a proper fact-based pro/con paper on this TA. Fourth, membership will absolutely vote it down if given unbiased analysis. Fifth, offer new negotiations to begin immediately, secure in the fact that for the first time, foot dragging HELPS us and HURTS management.
Spending any energy on alternative unions before we do the above is putting the cart before the horse. If this new TA passes, DPA or DALPA will not be able to help. Management will hold all the cards. If you're too mean to them, they'll equipment sub Europe to the C172-ER's and remove blocks from F/O's...all without violating our contract.
Carl
06-10-2015 | 05:50 PM
#7533
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 463
Likes: 0
12. Ab Initio. Very little detail so far but this, along with more large RJ's, breaths new life into outsourcing at the "regional" level.
It helps management produce more pilots in a short period of time and has been shown to produce pilots that are not safe. They lack experience that traditional vetting provides. It's bad for the profession in multiple ways.
Delta and other regional are throwing $80K additional money over 3 or 4 year to regional guys willing to stick around just so they can keep the RJ experiment/ whipsaw alive. I imagine they will lobby (with ALPA's help) to reduce required flight time and pay pilot candidates to go through pilot puppy academies to fill seats under contract. Why ALPA would join in this affair is anybodies guess. Oh yeah, Richard asked. Kill it now before it grows.
One of the side effects of pilots trained this way...
"The pilot found visual approaches difficult."
It helps management produce more pilots in a short period of time and has been shown to produce pilots that are not safe. They lack experience that traditional vetting provides. It's bad for the profession in multiple ways.
Delta and other regional are throwing $80K additional money over 3 or 4 year to regional guys willing to stick around just so they can keep the RJ experiment/ whipsaw alive. I imagine they will lobby (with ALPA's help) to reduce required flight time and pay pilot candidates to go through pilot puppy academies to fill seats under contract. Why ALPA would join in this affair is anybodies guess. Oh yeah, Richard asked. Kill it now before it grows.
One of the side effects of pilots trained this way...
"The pilot found visual approaches difficult."
Last edited by EdGrimley; 06-10-2015 at 06:10 PM.
06-10-2015 | 05:50 PM
#7534
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 432
Likes: 0
Maybe in contract 2020 if we get rid of all work rules and profit sharing and have to go to a company doctor to approve every 2 hours of sick leave and then just get rid of all scope clauses we can have an industry leading pay rate
06-10-2015 | 05:52 PM
#7535
Straight QOL, homie
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 4,202
Likes: 1
From: Record-Shattering Profit Facilitator
Ok, here is a quick list why this turd should be rejected. Feel free to ad to it:
1. Credit Suisse article showing its actually putting money in the company's pocket every year
2. Loss of Profit Sharing/buying our own raise. What's the company's predicted profit for the next three years? Also tweaking how PS is calculated will lower the amount
3. 3.b.4 will surely be triggered again and we will probably get around a 3% raise (a guess on my part)
4. 75% of LCA trips pulled out affects every FO in that category not just 180
5. More large RJ to DCI
6. JV metric changed to block hours from EASK's and lowered.
7. Only 1% to DC plan and that not until 2017
8. 5 to 10 cents more on per diem, puhleeze
9. Sick leave debacle. Third party verification? Not good if true
10. Vacation and training only adding 15 minutes a day?
11. New hire training freeze now 24 months? Throw the new hire under the bus
These off the top of my head......
Denny
1. Credit Suisse article showing its actually putting money in the company's pocket every year
2. Loss of Profit Sharing/buying our own raise. What's the company's predicted profit for the next three years? Also tweaking how PS is calculated will lower the amount
3. 3.b.4 will surely be triggered again and we will probably get around a 3% raise (a guess on my part)
4. 75% of LCA trips pulled out affects every FO in that category not just 180
5. More large RJ to DCI
6. JV metric changed to block hours from EASK's and lowered.
7. Only 1% to DC plan and that not until 2017
8. 5 to 10 cents more on per diem, puhleeze
9. Sick leave debacle. Third party verification? Not good if true
10. Vacation and training only adding 15 minutes a day?
11. New hire training freeze now 24 months? Throw the new hire under the bus
These off the top of my head......
Denny
Great talking points to counteract the propaganda steamroller being unleashed.
06-10-2015 | 05:53 PM
#7536
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 432
Likes: 0
I find this TA very motivating. It motivated me to email my ALPA reps several times pleading with them to vote no. (thank you NY reps, I think). It also motivated me to sign up for this forum and not just lurk. And if Caplinger wasn't such a tool it would motivate me to renew my DPA card. This last item is probably the most positive statement I will say about the TA.
06-10-2015 | 05:56 PM
#7538
Works Every Weekend
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 3,506
Likes: 0
From: 737 ATL
our biggest threat right now is the TA's scope where we change from EASK's to Block Hours. If this passes, we had better be really sweet to management because that'll be our only hope. They could buy extended range Cessna 172's (used of course) to fly those Euro routes and be in FULL COMPLIANCE with this new scope...because it's about block hours now - not EASK's.
That is correct. Hyperbolic but correct.
An A380 counts the same as a Cessna under the new deal.
06-10-2015 | 05:59 PM
#7539
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 463
Likes: 0
Guys, feel free to fill out a DPA card and even donate, but that won't cut it in the short term. We have to be thinking 5 moves ahead on this chess board, and our biggest threat right now is the TA's scope where we change from EASK's to Block Hours. If this passes, we had better be really sweet to management because that'll be our only hope. They could buy extended range Cessna 172's (used of course) to fly those Euro routes and be in FULL COMPLIANCE with this new scope...because it's about block hours now - not EASK's.
So first things first. First, recall as many of the YES voting reps as possible. Second, new MEC purges MEC administration of every elected chairman...and probably most of the admin members as well. Third, have the new MEC administration publish a proper fact-based pro/con paper on this TA. Fourth, membership will absolutely vote it down if given unbiased analysis. Fifth, offer new negotiations to begin immediately, secure in the fact that for the first time, foot dragging HELPS us and HURTS management.
Spending any energy on alternative unions before we do the above is putting the cart before the horse. If this new TA passes, DPA or DALPA will not be able to help. Management will hold all the cards. If you're too mean to them, they'll equipment sub Europe to the C172-ER's and remove blocks from F/O's...all without violating our contract.
Carl
So first things first. First, recall as many of the YES voting reps as possible. Second, new MEC purges MEC administration of every elected chairman...and probably most of the admin members as well. Third, have the new MEC administration publish a proper fact-based pro/con paper on this TA. Fourth, membership will absolutely vote it down if given unbiased analysis. Fifth, offer new negotiations to begin immediately, secure in the fact that for the first time, foot dragging HELPS us and HURTS management.
Spending any energy on alternative unions before we do the above is putting the cart before the horse. If this new TA passes, DPA or DALPA will not be able to help. Management will hold all the cards. If you're too mean to them, they'll equipment sub Europe to the C172-ER's and remove blocks from F/O's...all without violating our contract.
Carl
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