Its not even really ALPA it's AMAS, a contracted service.

 

What year did you first become a pilot represented by ALPA?

What has happened to you since you entered the industry will obviously color your world view.

Since I entered the industry in 1985, ALPA has allowed the B Scale, which started at American Airlines, a non-ALPA carrier. ALPA then did not support the Eastern Pilots when they took on Frank Lorenzo, all those loyal ALPA supporters lost their jobs.

ALPA then allowed 50% of the Major's domestic flying to be outsourced to minimum wage RJ operators.

After 9-11, as UAL and US Air were entering bankruptcy, ALPA allowed our retirements to be flushed down the toilet with zero pushback, no SOS threat, and no snap-back clause for when the airlines recovered.

After that, ALPA allowed our retirement age to be raised to 65, in direct opposition of the membership's survey results. That, along with the termination of our DB Plans, has caused us all to have to work 5 years longer, so 5 less years to 'enjoy' our retirements.

We are today working more days per month, for less money, with expensive health care premiums and very little retirement plan, compared to our former plans.

Did you read what our ALPA National President said about our contracts now being "Mature" and that he didn't see us making any real gains, but just arguing over a percent here and there? Proactive Appeasement is not how this profession became great.

Pick up the two books, Flying the Line, volumes one and two, read up on how we got to where we were in 2000, and then compare that to what you've seen going on since then.

About the only 'good' thing I see ALPA doing today is fighting against the Middle East carriers who would love to get their hundreds of wide body jets in to all the US Cities. If we lose that battle, we are toast, long term career wise. That is the only reason I still support ALPA and the PAC.

 

The ALPA PAC really is only useful if it is fighting for a cause management is also on board with. A4A is far and away more powerful than the ALPA PAC. The little things that the PAC is good for, such as the retirement tax exemption, could have been easily done by an independent union, because APA does it all the time.

 

OK guys, stop your contributions. It is a waste of money. The internet geniuses say so.

 

All good points. 1998 and I've read both books. You mention RJs and age 65. True career killers for people in my category. I do blame the RJ debacle on ALPA. We (you mostly ) allowed the camel's nose under the tent and the camel blew up the tent. Age 65 was heavily pushed by SWAPA. The B scale, as you stated, was first allowed by APA.

How many of these issues do you blame on the industry? The industry has been through the perfect storm in the last 15 years. In the end we're just an association against some huge money in the business world. We're a collection of individuals from 22 to 65 with different issues and priorities. I look at APA, SWAPA, and USAPA and don't like what I see. I see them using the assets and bargaining power of ALPA for their own interests. I look around and see carriers choosing to join ALPA. Perfect no, and probably needs a makeover, but the best option we have in my opinion.

 

Alpa is broken. Starting with the bloated salaries at the top to FPL free for all. It's become a business to some, a lifestyle to others. Out of touch with the Delta pilots, because they represent conflicting interests.

Our dues are their life blood and that's all they seem to care about. Too many coincidences this time around. The TA appears to have been crafted to get 51% of the vote. The vote was tallied before record profit announcement, an investment in GOL and possible investment in Skymark. Everything has been rushed to avoid our scrutiny.

The Alpa lifers keep their positions and the company gets another concessionary contract. Why isn't today's meeting in Atlanta? We all know why.

 

Well, hind sight is always 20-20, but when the industry was deregulated in 1978, ALPA should have had a plan to deal with what was about to happen, yet they had none, which led to most of the stuff I listed above.

They have never said "NO" to management or the politicians in DC. They continually drew lines in the sand, then jumped over them, in a race to the bottom of our wages/benefits, yet never said, "Enough! We WILL NOT FLY ANOTHER AIRPLANE as long as Frank Lorenzo (and all the Frank follow-on's) are using the Bankruptcy Courts to gut our contracts.

There are only what, about 60,000 US Pilots who hold ATP's and are actively flying today? WE can, and should have, shut this thing down once it was clear the CEO's were all going to declare bankruptcy to gut our contracts and flush our retirements.

Just a couple years ago the pilots of the APA were told they too had to give up their retirement plans in bankruptcy... "Or Else!".

Guess what?

They kept them, and American survived.

Since de-regulation, ALPA National should have focused on bringing in all the other independent unions, to gain the necessary leverage to have a credible SOS threat, when the Lorenzo's started taking the industry apart.

Yes, the POTUS could order us back to work, and we could tell him to shove it.

Someone high up in ALPA might have to go to jail for a few days, but in the end, if you don't use your right to NOT work, well, then you get what we've gotten, a continual spiral to the bottom of pay/benefits, while the CEO's pay/benefits are always going up, up, up.

Dave Bhenke was not afraid of a political fight, that's how we got paid what we were worth 30+ years ago. The 'Leaders' we've had since then are only concerned with using the job as a stepping stone to their next gig, witness Randy Babbit, Dwane Worth, Lee Moak.

Not one of those tools took it upon themselves to show any strength or pushback as the industry used the courts to destroy our pay/benefits, and now that the industry is minting money, they bring us more Cost Neutral, non-restorative contracts.

I'm glad we (the collective we) are finally seeing the light. Who could have predicted the FAA and FAR 117 would turn out to be our best friend? (1500 hr. rule).

The Airline Pilot Shortage is finally here, the CEO's for the past 30 years caused it, and they can just as easily fix it. Throw money at it, return us to our pre-bankruptcy pay/benefits, and kids will once again be lining up for flying lessons.

 

Maybe I'm naive enough to believe that can still happpen with the right leadership. You busy for the next few years?

 

Despite his backdoor fetish, my Timbo speaks for me.

 

Ok T, that's not what I said. I said you could achieve the same results of the PAC with an independent union. You would probably even have more disposable income to spend on lobbying, instead of providing life support to regionals.

The RJ debacle came about when the paint job was sold to the DCI carriers. Prior to the specific language permitting them to paint RJ's in Delta paint, Delta was allowed to code share with as many airplanes as they wanted. This is legal under labor law, the difference is, while they could code share as much as they wanted, they could not paint those aircraft in the Delta livery. So the paint job was released on a certain number of aircraft, to protect the pilot's share of flying larger jets. The result is Delta pilots will never fly a 80 seat, and below aircraft ever again. Interestingly, the latest TA had a provision to allow the chairman of DALPA to release the paint job to international codeshare airlines, if he/she so chooses. If the chairman were to release the paint job to foreign carriers, a Delta pilot is just as likely to fly a widebody again as they are to fly an RJ again.