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Originally Posted by sailingfun
(Post 1939455)
One thing I do know is that what is happening now has nothing to do with the contract. It's a power struggle pure and simple. The losers in the end will be the Delta pilot group.
Just when we though you couldn't possibly lose more credibility, you say that. |
Originally Posted by snowdawg
(Post 1939403)
Another TA in 6 months, Seriously?
Nobody should have any intentions of seeing a TA#2 until the matrix of profit sharing gouge Richards's pocketbook. I would love to sit on C12 until 2018. I doubt RA wants to do that. There is NO incentive for the company to change anything until profit sharing becomes a burden outside of TA/NA 2015. Duggie, You do realize the profits projected for 2016 and 2017 are above 6 billion per year, right? TA in 6 months? really? Forget it. See you in 2018................ |
Originally Posted by Purple Drank
(Post 1939457)
"...has nothing to do with the TA"
Just when we though you couldn't possibly lose more credibility, you say that. |
sailingfud,
If you voted no like you claimed, was it a signal that you wanted to banish ALPA? No? Now do you see how silly your claim is that no voters are DPA operatives? Likely not. |
Originally Posted by El10
(Post 1938999)
We have reached the same tipping point as national politics in that the louder voice can decree thier position as fact. This is not to say that the louder voice is not correct, just that volume has a higher weight than facts at times.
When ever the next TA is put out either by this MEC, a new MEC or the DPA MEC we will have the same issues. The root cause being able confirm "what" is fact and what is is "speculation". Either side (Pro/Con) can make a claim as fact and repeat it enough times that it is believed to be sound. So how does the quieter voice get heard if the other side has changed the facts? Is it time to have a neutral party fact check each position? Maybe we grade the costing at the amendable date to see how well the company and E&FA did on costing. Or do we count all the "they never will"/"they will" claims and keep a track record of each side? What do you guys think some options? I have a suggestion. Do what I did, read the TA. After I read the TA, I had a few questions. I listened to the analysis of the former negotiators and former MEC chairman. Unfortunately, they confirmed my concerns. Therefore, the vote was no. I'll follow the same process in the future. I'll read the TA. Find the areas of concern and gain. Weigh these areas of concern against the gains. Then, I will make a decision. No reps, no roadshows, no drama. The good news is information and thought are being freely shared and are readily available. |
Originally Posted by sailingfun
(Post 1939459)
The TA is being used as a tool. Nothing more or less. Getting the best contract for the Delta pilot group is not the concern.
On it's merits, the TA fell short. And concessions are unwarranted. |
Originally Posted by sailingfun
(Post 1939459)
The TA is being used as a tool. Nothing more or less. Getting the best contract for the Delta pilot group is not the concern.
This opportunity is being facilitated by the Alpa guys hanging on to their seats. If each LEC would allow their membership to go the DALPA /Alpa route of going thru the recalls and re votes, the DPA opportunity is gone. It is up to each LEC to choose. I believe several yes to the TA guys will keep their seats. Some clearly NEED to go. If the recalls are stonewalled, that, in and of itself, is the DPA opportunity. This is about delta pilot representation and the best possible contract. We were lied to, plain and simple. We were not honestly represented, plain and simple. This is the opportunity the Delta MEC is fostering for the DPA. As FTB so concisely noted, Alpa was brought down by an $800k sell job.:confused: if that happens, then yes, it's going to be awhile before we see a TA. That, my friend is entirely on the DALPA MEC...not DPA opportunists. |
Originally Posted by Hank Kingsley
(Post 1939484)
If you believe that you're delusional. No one I've flown with or talked to felt the TA was a political tool to change unions.
On it's merits, the TA fell short. And concessions are unwarranted. The TA needed changes. With the current path we are on the chance of producing a new agreement that provides more value to the pilot group is virtually zero. |
Originally Posted by sailingfun
(Post 1939455)
The group behind the organized effort to vote all yes voters of the MEC is the same group that is essentially DPA. The DPA guys should also be careful of their bar bragging in AMS. A few beers causes them to talk to much. TC might have to fire a few guys.
One thing I do know is that what is happening now has nothing to do with the contract. It's a power struggle pure and simple. The losers in the end will be the Delta pilot group. Please, explain your logic. |
The truth of 750-800k from an established body verses 1-2k total from loosely associated activists speaks volumes about intent of the MEC and the quality or lack of, in the TA.
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