Please, Oh wise one, explain to us how Old Fly Guy revised history. Also, share with us how we should cave on scope on both ends because of retirements and how we wont feel it.

 

[QUOTE=Dat jet;2150572]I don't have a problem necessarily with Delta having JVs/codeshares because it does have its advantages, but IT DOES bother me we do it so much. While UAL and AA have three times to four times as many 777s as we do...and are taking deliveries of 777-300s right now (which we don't even have on order) and they both have 787s on property. They'll get more and more of those type of aircraft while we fly around 767-300/300ERs.....and where is the replacement for these 72 aircraft? Don't say it's the new A350/A330 NEO order...that's only 50 aircraft. Between the 767 fleet and the 747 fleet....that's 88 aircraft. 72 + 16 = 88. And don't forget we have a whopping 18 777s

We have 58 767 ER's and 8 747's at the moment. We have 53 A330/A350's coming in the next 5 years. There are no 767ER retirements planned until after 2020 so we will lose 8 airframes. The current plan is to retire each airframe when it reaches 30 years old. They stated at the roadshows that they plan a 7ER replacement order in 2019 and that might be split into two or three orders.
A big chunk of the A330's and A350's coming were planned for the Shanghai hub. Rumor only on this part but negotiations with the Chinese are not going well and that may be why 4 A350 orders were delayed.

 

[QUOTE=WhatNow;2151018]I would emphasize current plans. They do change. The driving philosophy is to leverage ownership in partner airlines to derisk Delta and drive efficiencies. There is no growth strategy outside of JV+equity acquisitions. Sorry to burst your bubble but organic growth is dead.

 

You know darn well those orders can be restructured at any time. Until they are on the property, they don't exist as far as pilots are concerned.

 

The orders at AMR and UAL can't be restructured? What is your point? Would you rather have no orders? As long as I can remember since the merger you have made similar statements about each batch of aircraft ordered. You have been wrong every time.

 

[QUOTE=WhatNow;2151018]Unfortunately, these are plans that haven't helped the thousands of First Officers that have lived the stagnation here at Delta while AMR/UAL and our JV/Codeshare brothers amass hundreds of 777/A350/787/A380's. Not sure what color your glasses are, but that's the reality.

In fact, we have reduced our highest paying jobs. And here at Delta, the 777 has been described as an airplane with nowhere to go. Not my words. Why some continue to ignore the fact that Delta has become the travel agent to AF/KLM etc. is beyond me. Because of that practice, we have 18 777's and 8 747's, 26 highest tier paying aircraft. And we are falling behind. Our orders won't keep up. Those 58 767-ER's pay less than they did over 10 years ago. What's the replacement aircraft out there?

The Chinese don't want Apple in their markets either, what happens when they decide PVG isn't a Delta hub. Speculation doesn't cut it.

 

[QUOTE=Hank Kingsley;2151036]
You might want to look at actual hiring and advancement over the last 10 years at UAL and American compared to Delta. I think we have hired more then UAL and AMR combined.

There are no replacement aircraft being ordered yet for the 767ER because they are not being retired. Since Anderson came onboard the policy has been to order as aircraft are needed in small batches. It's been a very good policy. There was a recent article talking about how much less Delta has been paying for new airframes by buying on short notice opportunity.
I am clearly the optimist among the perpetual doom and gloomers on here but I actually don't think the Shanghai hub will materialize in the form Delta wants. If that happens I would expect to see the one of three things happen.
Current WB orders stay and 7ers retired earlier.
Current WB orders restructured
Current WB orders remain and 7Er's shifted to domestic transcons on a attempt to dominate that market.
Tell me the price of fuel in 3 years and I will tell you which one I think will happen.

 

I trust our management group to take care and look out for themselves only! That is what they have been doing for years now.. We are nothing more than an item on the debit side of the ledger to them. What actions by our current management has lead you to believe they give a rat's arse about our pilot group?? You do know that C.E. Woolman is no longer in charge right???

 

[QUOTE=WhatNow;2151041]Oh, I assume you're a wide body Captain, you have convince the FO's you fly with. Most of the ones I work with have 20 years minimum and plan on retiring in that seat. If you were in the stagnant seat, you'd be singing a different tune.

 

[QUOTE=Hank Kingsley;2151051]The few trips I have flown my FO's look like they were 12 years old!