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Airline Pilot Central Forums (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/)
-   Delta (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/delta/)
-   -   Negotiation sessions scheduled (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/delta/96926-negotiation-sessions-scheduled.html)

Dat jet 09-01-2016 01:32 PM
Originally Posted by texandriver (Post 2193345)
as someone that was unable to vote on the last ta, you can be sure i'll be looking at the above items on the next one and will have no qualms voting no if they don't change from the aips. Pay raises are nice, but not if they're paid for with concessions especially when i have 20+ years remaining.
bingo!!!!!

Timbo 09-01-2016 01:33 PM
Originally Posted by sailingfun (Post 2193344)
There are other aspects you omit. The biggest being pickups allowed at straight rates to FAR limits. That's a Delta management wet dream!
You don't think that's happening at Delta right now? We have no hard caps, just FAR117. Guys use the P2P swap board and/or swap with the pot to get way above ALV+15 every day.

sailingfun 09-01-2016 03:11 PM
Originally Posted by Timbo (Post 2193353)
You don't think that's happening at Delta right now? We have no hard caps, just FAR117. Guys use the P2P swap board and/or swap with the pot to get way above ALV+15 every day.
Some do, it's certainly not possible in my category. If we dropped the caps you would see a enormous job loss. There are outliers for everything. In my prior category I was probably averaging 78 hours working 9 days a month and getting positive space to and from work. I don't post it saying how great things are at Delta because I know it's not the norm.
Of course according to the forum nobody can swap anything!

marcal 09-01-2016 03:18 PM
Originally Posted by Purple Drank (Post 2193245)
They can change anything they want in the AIPs. I'm a "no" based on the sick TA language. That's right. The sick leave garbage has already been TA'd. It won't change.

Other pilot groups improve their QOL, while we actively seek to sell it. Pathetic.
LOL. The TA could offer 100% raises and 364 days off a year and you'd vote no.

MikeF16 09-01-2016 03:22 PM
Originally Posted by marcal (Post 2193424)
LOL. The TA could offer 100% raises and 364 days off a year and you'd vote no.
That would equate to double work during a leap year. F-no!

OldFlyGuy 09-01-2016 03:27 PM
Originally Posted by Timbo (Post 2193353)
You don't think that's happening at Delta right now? We have no hard caps, just FAR117. Guys use the P2P swap board and/or swap with the pot to get way above ALV+15 every day.
Timbo is right on this. One of my contract survey/polling issues has been to limit ALL pickup to ALV + 15. Mgmt LOVES when we volunteer to fly straight rate to FAR. Dude called me last year to swap a trip.. so he could position himself to pick up to FAR... I told him he'd personally probably cost someone 3 GS the preceding year. Duhh. I also don't understand PD's comments about the fitness review board... isn't the FRB an improvement over current language? Another "poster" seems to think UAL's work rules are better... How? 1 Cap and 3 FO on ultra long haul? Would you like that Timbo? A few days ago someone complained that new hires on reserve were being flown every day... in summer... Really? They are new hires on reserve on call. We have all been there. It's an education in the seniority vs junior-ity system. Contract wise I'm not advocating giving up much, but exchanges greatly in our favor need consideration and occasionally on the Forum we should compare apples to apples. Still awaiting a final product. Still a little angry with company response(s)... engaged.. No hurry. OFG

sailingfun 09-01-2016 03:32 PM
Originally Posted by OldFlyGuy (Post 2193432)
Timbo is right on this. One of my contract survey/polling issues has been to limit ALL pickup to ALV + 15. Mgmt LOVES when we volunteer to fly straight rate to FAR. Dude called me last year to swap a trip.. so he could position himself to pick up to FAR... I told him he'd personally probably cost someone 3 GS the preceding year. Duhh. I also don't understand PD's comments about the fitness review board... isn't the FRB an improvement over current language? Another "poster" seems to think UAL's work rules are better... How? 1 Cap and 3 FO on ultra long haul? Would you like that Timbo? A few days ago someone complained that new hires on reserve were being flown every day... in summer... Really? They are new hires on reserve on call. We have all been there. It's an education in the seniority vs junior-ity system. Contract wise I'm not advocating giving up much, but exchanges greatly in our favor need consideration and occasionally on the Forum we should compare apples to apples. Still awaiting a final product. Still a little angry with company response(s)... engaged.. No hurry. OFG
The Fitness review board is a big improvement over what we now have. The real beauty of it is that you can't not get paid for a fatigue call unless the union agrees with it. If the 2/2 board deadlocks you're paid.

Sink r8 09-01-2016 03:37 PM
Originally Posted by OldFlyGuy (Post 2193432)
Timbo is right on this. One of my contract survey/polling issues has been to limit ALL pickup to ALV + 15. Mgmt LOVES when we volunteer to fly straight rate to FAR. Dude called me last year to swap a trip.. so he could position himself to pick up to FAR... I told him he'd personally probably cost someone 3 GS the preceding year. Duhh. I also don't understand PD's comments about the fitness review board... isn't the FRB an improvement over current language? Another "poster" seems to think UAL's work rules are better... How? 1 Cap and 3 FO on ultra long haul? Would you like that Timbo? A few days ago someone complained that new hires on reserve were being flown every day... in summer... Really? They are new hires on reserve on call. We have all been there. It's an education in the seniority vs junior-ity system. Contract wise I'm not advocating giving up much, but exchanges greatly in our favor need consideration and occasionally on the Forum we should compare apples to apples. Still awaiting a final product. Still a little angry with company response(s)... engaged.. No hurry. OFG
Agree. We don't have a functional cap. I think we're too permissive. I think a lot of guys would pop a vein if we tried to change it, even some of the people who claim to be QOL afficionados.

sailingfun 09-01-2016 03:52 PM
Originally Posted by Sink r8 (Post 2193439)
Agree. We don't have a functional cap. I think we're too permissive. I think a lot of guys would pop a vein if we tried to change it, even some of the people who claim to be QOL afficionados.
Vacation and training should also be pay and credit.

crewdawg 09-01-2016 04:27 PM
Originally Posted by sailingfun (Post 2193446)
Vacation and training should also be pay and credit.
Agreed...at 5.15 or greater.


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