An American buddy of mine posted this and it gave me a chuckle in light of our seemingly never going away DPA.

Unhappy American Pilots to Push Union Switch After Five Decades

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...r-five-decades

A group of American Airlines Group Inc. pilots is preparing a push to give up their 53-year-old independent union and join the larger Air Line Pilots Association, after peers at rival carriers secured tentative contracts with better pay and benefits.
Resolutions calling for creation of an Allied Pilots Association committee to evaluate the issue will be introduced in at least two pilot bases over the next two weeks, according to interviews with aviators supporting the change. The proposals could go to the union’s board for approval, with the goal of merging APA into ALPA, they said.

Frustration has been building over the past two months among APA members after pilots at Delta Air Lines Inc. and Southwest Airlines Co. agreed to tentative terms that would boost their compensation above that in a contract American aviators reached last year. If Delta pilots approve their accord, a provision in United Continental Holdings Inc.’s labor agreement would increase pay at that carrier to the same rates. United Parcel Service Inc. and FedEx Corp. aviators also have gained new contracts since last year.

“There’s a well-founded belief that APA, as an independent union, underperforms,” said Mitch Vasin, an American first officer based in Phoenix. “It can’t compete with a national union with the resources and political connections and the size of ALPA. This has been at a simmer, and when the Delta pilots reached their tentative agreement, it turned the heat up a lot.”

‘Simply Unacceptable’
Supporters of the merger also say APA’s structure, with a 22-member board, makes reaching consensus difficult and slows decisions. While ALPA represents Delta, United and FedEx pilots, Southwest and UPS have independent unions similar to APA.

“Our pilot compensation will soon likely rank a distant fifth or sixth in the industry,” APA President Dan Carey told the union board last week. “As the largest pilot group in the world, employed by the most profitable airline in the world, that’s simply unacceptable.”

Carey told members “it’s time to have the debate” about closer ties to the larger union, although he didn’t call for a combination. The two unions have worked together in the past, including APA’s use of an ALPA expert in contract negotiations.

“We believe that all pilots would greatly benefit through single representation,” Tim Canoll, ALPA president, said in an e-mailed statement. “With a strong, unified voice, pilots would be even better positioned to secure valuable improvements to advance our profession and further strengthen aviation safety and security.”

Forgotten Reason
APA represents 15,000 pilots from four carriers that have merged into one since 2001: American, US Airways, America West and TWA. ALPA has more than 54,000 pilots at 31 airlines in the U.S. and Canada. APA split off from ALPA in 1963, and “pretty much everyone has forgotten any reason why,” said Mitch Groder, an American first officer based in Philadelphia.

Some pilots oppose the return to ALPA out of concern that dues would rise and that the bigger national structure is inefficient. Also, the larger union represents regional airline pilots, whose interests don’t always line up with those of the bigger carriers.

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Joining ALPA would provide many benefits, advocates say. Besides gaining lobbying clout in Washington on regulatory, safety and security issues, it would give American pilots access to the larger union’s legal, economic, financial and other experts. A stronger ALPA could take on issues like overhauling the federal law governing airline labor and how union contracts are treated in bankruptcy, said Neil Roghair, a former APA vice president who advocated a merger when he left office in February.
American pilots also could influence ALPA, he said in an online posting, noting they would account for more than 20 percent of the combined union’s total membership.

“The debate ought to happen,” said Vasin, the American first officer. “If it doesn’t go through, at a bare minimum we can identify things that can be changed at APA to make it better.”

 

They'd be the biggest pilot group in ALPA and in 4 years would have pilots in all the national committees with many of them in leadership positions.

We'd all be better off with them by our side.

 

I have been at UAL for 20 years. Over the course of that 20 years, American pilots have been compensated considerably higher than we have for probably 15 of those years (maybe 16). We got a huge contract in 2000 that lasted 2 years, and we finally got back to that level 10 months ago. I think looking at a short window of time in the last year, and wanting to $#itcan your union because of that would be very short sighted.

A friend of mine at USair said APA was the biggest breath of fresh air he had seen in 30 years.

 

It started with "a group of pilots..." so how many are they talking about?

I doubt this is anywhere close to a card drive but who knows. Speaking of DPA, they seem to be very, very back burner lately anyway.

 

That's because Delta, NWA, and United all filed for bankruptcy 10-12 years ago and essentially had contract terms imposed on them by a bankruptcy judge. American pilot agreed to cuts, but not as steep as those taken by the pilots at carriers who filed for bankruptcy protection.

 

The APA - ALPA merger was almost a done deal until 9/11 sidelined everything.

 

Coffee meet laptop.

 

>>They'd be the biggest pilot group in ALPA and in 4 years would have pilots in all the national committees with many of them in leadership positions.

We'd all be better off with them by our side. <<

This is an interesting thought, thanks for bringing it up.

OTOH, Getting them on board could be a catalyst for a significant dues reduction (and they can start picking up some of the tab for the smaller carriers in ALPA).

Another issue to consider might be what kind of legal festivities are going on with the various pre-merger groups at the new "happy family" over at American. We don't need to inherit any of that.

 

The American pilots agreed to those cuts early in the economic downturn before anyone filled chapter 11. That allowed AMR to preserve large amounts of cash. That was widely criticized by other unions but in the end turned out to be smart.

 

Guys, it's about time. All I can say is that, yes while our pay may have been temporarily higher than others, our work rules have always lagged behind UAL and DAL. APA has long been broken beyond repair and management long ago figured out how to take advantage of that - starting with the B scale sellout in the '80s.

To the United pilot who commented above (Probe) - you couldn't be more mistaken. Had AA pilots been ALPA, we wouldn't have taken it in the shorts all these years, and especially this last JCBA where we are still working under BK work rules while the company is taking in billions.

Here's how bad AA plays APA: we asked for significant work rule improvements for our JCBA and were told they couldn't afford it. Then, Kirby leaves AA for UA and management slips him a cool $13 million just to pacify him. That $13 million could have gone towards our non existent hotel language or our non existent min calendar day.

Bottom line is that APA gets played like a fiddle every contract cycle. We have NEVER had a true industry leading contract.

It's time for ALPA. Our joining would not only greatly strengthen ALPA, but dues would probably also come down, and there would be one more legacy pilot group joined in membership off of which to pattern bargain from.

The world's largest airline pilot group should not be represented by a broken, ineffective in house boys club. We need a global and powerful union.

Bring it on.