Endeavor to Delta
10-09-2014, 03:48 PM
#41
:-)
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Posts: 7,339
Originally Posted by CarolinaAngler
Where does it say what happens to an EtD if we shut down? Delta would be up to their ears in litigation if EtD went straight to mainline if we shut down. And ALPA as well. That would be an EPIC class action suit. You can count on that.
There are so few people who made it through the EtD, or who will make it thru the EtD, there would be no material impact to the Delta operation to add these people to the bottom of the list. The EtD is not an ALPA contractual item either, it is an independent contract between the EtD candidate, and Delta. ALPA may not like it, but there is nothing they can do about it.
Also, the EtD candidates are considered Delta's own, and they take care of their own people. To expect that an EtD would get screwed in the end is not realistic, other than just straight 9E/Delta bashing.
10-09-2014, 04:23 PM
#42
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2013
Position: The Parlor
Posts: 1,243
Originally Posted by PinnacleFO
The Ssp is all based on how many delta hires next year if they hire 600 subtract the 110 compass flows and then take 35 percent of that and it's roughly 14-15 per month. If delta hires 900 then we would get 300 or 25 per month. I suspect it will be somewhere between 15-20 per month we get.
Just using 600 as an example a typical month would be 20 compass flows, 15 endeavor and 15 off the street. One of the reasons I suspect delta is hiring so many off the street right now is that they know for about the first 6 months next year they wont have that many off the street slots available.
In regards to the endeavor to delta in 5 years question: think about this, once we are at 81 900s if delta takes 300 of us a year indefinetly, it will wipe out our entire pilot group every 4 years or so so there is your fast upgrades and quick progression to delta right there. It's just a matter of getting to the right pilot count before that begins which is probably why they are not to worried about staffing yet
Just using 600 as an example a typical month would be 20 compass flows, 15 endeavor and 15 off the street. One of the reasons I suspect delta is hiring so many off the street right now is that they know for about the first 6 months next year they wont have that many off the street slots available.
In regards to the endeavor to delta in 5 years question: think about this, once we are at 81 900s if delta takes 300 of us a year indefinetly, it will wipe out our entire pilot group every 4 years or so so there is your fast upgrades and quick progression to delta right there. It's just a matter of getting to the right pilot count before that begins which is probably why they are not to worried about staffing yet
10-09-2014, 04:26 PM
#43
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2011
Posts: 4,504
Originally Posted by Mesabah
It doesn't go to a lawsuit, it goes to arbitration. Fact is, it is simply the best case scenario for Delta to take these pilots onto their list. For Delta to take on a different course, would open them up to a massive lawsuit, and likely **** off the arbitrator who may make the call anyway. But, I don't think it will ever reach arbitration if we shut down, they will be simply added to the Delta list immediately to avoid any negative outcome.
There are so few people who made it through the EtD, or who will make it thru the EtD, there would be no material impact to the Delta operation to add these people to the bottom of the list. The EtD is not an ALPA contractual item either, it is an independent contract between the EtD candidate, and Delta. ALPA may not like it, but there is nothing they can do about it.
Also, the EtD candidates are considered Delta's own, and they take care of their own people. To expect that an EtD would get screwed in the end is not realistic, other than just straight 9E/Delta bashing.
There are so few people who made it through the EtD, or who will make it thru the EtD, there would be no material impact to the Delta operation to add these people to the bottom of the list. The EtD is not an ALPA contractual item either, it is an independent contract between the EtD candidate, and Delta. ALPA may not like it, but there is nothing they can do about it.
Also, the EtD candidates are considered Delta's own, and they take care of their own people. To expect that an EtD would get screwed in the end is not realistic, other than just straight 9E/Delta bashing.
10-09-2014, 04:30 PM
#44
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,648
Just out of curiosity how many guys have even been hired under the EtD program?
10-09-2014, 04:55 PM
#45
:-)
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Posts: 7,339
Originally Posted by Bzzt
Just out of curiosity how many guys have even been hired under the EtD program?
We were far more successful getting people in the door before the EtD.
10-09-2014, 05:30 PM
#46
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2013
Position: Satisfied
Posts: 379
Originally Posted by Mesabah
4 were hired in July, 2 of those already quit. There were 8 in August, but only 3 of those are left; 4 hired in September; 1 hired so far for October. So the answer is 17 with 10 still here.
We were far more successful getting people in the door before the EtD.
We were far more successful getting people in the door before the EtD.
10-09-2014, 07:26 PM
#47
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2011
Posts: 843
They probably came here and realized how bad delta really is. They saw that our fo's are so poor that they live on food stamps, and getting based in nyc is fun for our fo's as well. We have fo's so poor that 3 or 4 of them rent a car and sleep in the parking lot. Now that's how delta really is to it's ppl.
10-09-2014, 08:00 PM
#48
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2012
Posts: 344
Originally Posted by Mesabah
It doesn't go to a lawsuit, it goes to arbitration. Fact is, it is simply the best case scenario for Delta to take these pilots onto their list. For Delta to take on a different course, would open them up to a massive lawsuit, and likely **** off the arbitrator who may make the call anyway. But, I don't think it will ever reach arbitration if we shut down, they will be simply added to the Delta list immediately to avoid any negative outcome.
There are so few people who made it through the EtD, or who will make it thru the EtD, there would be no material impact to the Delta operation to add these people to the bottom of the list. The EtD is not an ALPA contractual item either, it is an independent contract between the EtD candidate, and Delta. ALPA may not like it, but there is nothing they can do about it.
Also, the EtD candidates are considered Delta's own, and they take care of their own people. To expect that an EtD would get screwed in the end is not realistic, other than just straight 9E/Delta bashing.
There are so few people who made it through the EtD, or who will make it thru the EtD, there would be no material impact to the Delta operation to add these people to the bottom of the list. The EtD is not an ALPA contractual item either, it is an independent contract between the EtD candidate, and Delta. ALPA may not like it, but there is nothing they can do about it.
Also, the EtD candidates are considered Delta's own, and they take care of their own people. To expect that an EtD would get screwed in the end is not realistic, other than just straight 9E/Delta bashing.
10-09-2014, 08:09 PM
#49
Da Hudge
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Poodle Whisperer
Posts: 17,473
Originally Posted by CarolinaAngler
I bet those that get sent packing would say other wise. The EtD grants you employment at Endeavor not Delta. There is zero public documentation that says EtDs go to Delta in the event of a shutdown and to tell someone that is wrong and misleading.
10-09-2014, 11:03 PM
#50
:-)
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Posts: 7,339
Originally Posted by CarolinaAngler
I bet those that get sent packing would say other wise. The EtD grants you employment at Endeavor not Delta. There is zero public documentation that says EtDs go to Delta in the event of a shutdown and to tell someone that is wrong and misleading.
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