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FullThrust 03-18-2018 03:14 PM


Originally Posted by f16jetmech (Post 2553535)
Got a response from "next day assignment desk" that the 2 below me that got RAP1 were "preassigned" so that's why they got it and why it couldn't be changed.

That makes sense, but on the other hand, what the hell is the point of the seniority system? Should I just not proffer and get a default assigned RAP1?

Honest question. Have you actually read the section of our contract on how raps are assigned?

It sounds like the two junior to you were on their first day of reserve availability. You are on your last. So it’s not an apples to apples seniority assignment comparison. If they were on their last day, then you would have a case.

moon 03-18-2018 03:34 PM


Originally Posted by f16jetmech (Post 2553535)
Got a response from "next day assignment desk" that the 2 below me that got RAP1 were "preassigned" so that's why they got it and why it couldn't be changed.

That makes sense, but on the other hand, what the hell is the point of the seniority system? Should I just not proffer and get a default assigned RAP1?

Call the union. The arbitrator said they could pre assign, but next day proffers still had to be based on seniority.

Pedro4President 03-18-2018 03:41 PM


Originally Posted by f16jetmech (Post 2553535)
Got a response from "next day assignment desk" that the 2 below me that got RAP1 were "preassigned" so that's why they got it and why it couldn't be changed.

That makes sense, but on the other hand, what the hell is the point of the seniority system? Should I just not proffer and get a default assigned RAP1?

Call your union rep or email contract compliance.

Pedro4President 03-18-2018 03:48 PM


Originally Posted by FullThrust (Post 2553573)
Honest question. Have you actually read the section of our contract on how raps are assigned?

It sounds like the two junior to you were on their first day of reserve availability. You are on your last. So it’s not an apples to apples seniority assignment comparison. If they were on their last day, then you would have a case.

Yes I have read the contract where RAPs are assigned. His situation was a clear violation of an arbitrated ruling. This is my biggest frustration with reserve and CS.

Bigpimppilot 03-18-2018 04:14 PM

If you don’t proffer you aren’t auto awarded 4am

FullThrust 03-18-2018 04:19 PM


Originally Posted by Pedro4President (Post 2553600)
Yes I have read the contract where RAPs are assigned. His situation was a clear violation of an arbitrated ruling. This is my biggest frustration with reserve and CS.

While I agree it sucks, it is not a “clear violation”.

The guys below him didn’t have the same number of days availability. Hence, CS will (and can per our contract) that he was assigned rap2 due to coverage requirements.

Here is the excerpt from Section 12 B

Pilots may submit a preference for a RAP during daily reserve open time proffering. Crew Scheduling will assign RAPs in seniority order BASED ON:
a) availability of the rap
b) coverage requirements
c) FAR legality
d) pilot’s preference

bigtime209 03-18-2018 05:52 PM


Originally Posted by FullThrust (Post 2553624)
While I agree it sucks, it is not a “clear violation”.

The guys below him didn’t have the same number of days availability. Hence, CS will (and can per our contract) that he was assigned rap2 due to coverage requirements.

Here is the excerpt from Section 12 B

Pilots may submit a preference for a RAP during daily reserve open time proffering. Crew Scheduling will assign RAPs in seniority order BASED ON:
a) availability of the rap
b) coverage requirements
c) FAR legality
d) pilot’s preference

There was an arbitration and ruling on the pre assigned raps. The arbitration supersedes the older language. It states how things are to be done. While in principal we lost the arbitration, the company was unhappy and wouldn't sign the arbitration for a long time because it tied their hands when it came to seniority and assigning RAPs.

f16jetmech 03-19-2018 08:23 PM

This isn't a huge deal, but could be at some point when it means me going home or not. I mean CS ended up releasing me @ 1330. 3 and a half hours into my shift she said yeah to home! So I'm not interested in being difficult about not getting the RAP I want when they're letting me go so easily.

If I was stuck until 1159 tonight then I might pursue this more. I was more curious than anything. Seems like there's no real clear answer... But logic says it doesn't make any sense that some guy who "forgot to proffer so he gets RAP1" but the guy who's above him and DID proffer, doesn't get what he wants.

Pedro4President 03-20-2018 02:51 AM


Originally Posted by f16jetmech (Post 2554496)
This isn't a huge deal, but could be at some point when it means me going home or not. I mean CS ended up releasing me @ 1330. 3 and a half hours into my shift she said yeah to home! So I'm not interested in being difficult about not getting the RAP I want when they're letting me go so easily.

If I was stuck until 1159 tonight then I might pursue this more. I was more curious than anything. Seems like there's no real clear answer... But logic says it doesn't make any sense that some guy who "forgot to proffer so he gets RAP1" but the guy who's above him and DID proffer, doesn't get what he wants.

Please at least file a fact sheet with union. You don't even have to request any compensation although you would likely get something. The fact is that this situation is the single biggest contract violation CS continues to abuse. You didn't get burned this time but you may get it next time.

Also, I almost always push for a RAP 2 on my last day. The last turn gets back at 9ish. A RAP 1 is contractually available until 7 pm and legal until 8 plus the extension. Plus you avoid the likelyhood of doing the S1 standby shift.

Pedro4President 03-20-2018 03:00 AM


Originally Posted by FullThrust (Post 2553624)
While I agree it sucks, it is not a “clear violation”.

The guys below him didn’t have the same number of days availability. Hence, CS will (and can per our contract) that he was assigned rap2 due to coverage requirements.

Here is the excerpt from Section 12 B

Pilots may submit a preference for a RAP during daily reserve open time proffering. Crew Scheduling will assign RAPs in seniority order BASED ON:
a) availability of the rap
b) coverage requirements
c) FAR legality
d) pilot’s preference

(IMO!)
Your point on coverage availability only stands if the junior pilot below has less days off then you. You are good for two and the junior pilot is good for one so CS assigned you a RAP 2 and the junior pilot a RAP 1 when you proffered for a RAP 1.

Also a pre assigned RAP wasn't assigned based on coverage availability it was pre assigned.


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