Flow at 9.28 Years
#12
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2016
Posts: 524
Only Air Wisconsin, Mesa, Expressjet, and CommutAir are eligible carriers for Aviate.
#13
Banned
Joined APC: Aug 2019
Posts: 273
Not to mention QOL and pay is terrible at the UAL feeders.
This is just to lure people in the door without spending extra cash.
The program could prove to be improved over the long haul but the past metrics prove otherwise...
#15
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2019
Posts: 1,272
For all the new hires wanting to come to Envoy for the AA flow-thru agreement, please note the latest ALPA projected flow date for the most junior pilot on property:
Years to American: 9.28 years
Transfer Date: January 2029
You'll have thousands upon thousands of new hires from 2020-2028 above you on the seniority list by the time you would be eligible to crossover... if the flow still exists or isn't metered by the company.
While the new United Aviate program does not have any guarantees, you could at least be in a pipeline to start with United in as little as 2 years. Under the old United Career Path Program, there were pilots at CommutAir going over to UAL in ~2 years. Crazy.
Years to American: 9.28 years
Transfer Date: January 2029
You'll have thousands upon thousands of new hires from 2020-2028 above you on the seniority list by the time you would be eligible to crossover... if the flow still exists or isn't metered by the company.
While the new United Aviate program does not have any guarantees, you could at least be in a pipeline to start with United in as little as 2 years. Under the old United Career Path Program, there were pilots at CommutAir going over to UAL in ~2 years. Crazy.
#16
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2017
Posts: 3,649
The flow here has less and less value the newer you are, almost to the point of being useless. I for one welcome other major carriers to start programs because it will lift the entirety of regional flow programs.
#17
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2018
Posts: 108
Remember flow for the last group of pilots (after L1011 guys) is based off of a percentage of total number of pilots at the company. With Envoy growing at the rate it is, even with attrition of pilots to other airlines, the total pilot group will grow hopefully pushing the group after the L1011 guys back up to 25-30 a month. I truly believe even the guys and gals showing 9+ year flows will be surprised when they're flowing in under 7.
Lastly I'd just like to say people have this notion, (especially at the WO's) that getting to a Legacy somehow is easy because we see the top 29 people skim off to AA every month. Trust me, it's not. If that was the case all Check Airman, Captains with 1000+ PIC, etc. (from all airlines) would all be gone and there by now. I can't tell you how many people I know who are fully qualified, do all the right things, and still haven't gotten any call from anywhere. I try and stay away from the Kool Aid but I'm also no fool in not valuing the flow that we have.
Lastly I'd just like to say people have this notion, (especially at the WO's) that getting to a Legacy somehow is easy because we see the top 29 people skim off to AA every month. Trust me, it's not. If that was the case all Check Airman, Captains with 1000+ PIC, etc. (from all airlines) would all be gone and there by now. I can't tell you how many people I know who are fully qualified, do all the right things, and still haven't gotten any call from anywhere. I try and stay away from the Kool Aid but I'm also no fool in not valuing the flow that we have.
#19
Don’t have the formula handy now.
#20
Line Holder
Joined APC: Oct 2017
Posts: 34
Even if we have 3000 pilots, the agreement is the lesser of 25% of AA slots or the formula based on how many pilots at envoy. So if AA hire 1000 pilots in a year we would flow 20/month even with 3000 or 4000 pilots on property.
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