Envoy AA4125 Slides off ORD Runway Video
11-13-2019, 08:09 AM
#92
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Joined APC: Jul 2019
Posts: 196
Originally Posted by rickair7777
There was no aileron input for sure, anybody know what the winds were?
The counter-productive component of reverse thrust actually comes into play if the plane is crabbed into the wind. More common for that to be a factor when the jet starts sliding downwind, pilot uses rudder to try to correct into the wind, inducing a crab and thereby aggravating the problem if the TRs are operating (in that case you need to idle the TRs as you correct the slide).
A little hard to make out, but I didn't see the plane crabbing UPWIND at all, which would be the instinctive reaction. Same with aileron use. Wondering if they had some malfunction which induced left yaw (stuck brake, asymmetric thrust, steering)? Any of those would be recoverable on a dry runway (BTDT)...
The counter-productive component of reverse thrust actually comes into play if the plane is crabbed into the wind. More common for that to be a factor when the jet starts sliding downwind, pilot uses rudder to try to correct into the wind, inducing a crab and thereby aggravating the problem if the TRs are operating (in that case you need to idle the TRs as you correct the slide).
A little hard to make out, but I didn't see the plane crabbing UPWIND at all, which would be the instinctive reaction. Same with aileron use. Wondering if they had some malfunction which induced left yaw (stuck brake, asymmetric thrust, steering)? Any of those would be recoverable on a dry runway (BTDT)...
11-13-2019, 08:31 AM
#94
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Joined APC: Jul 2017
Position: CRJ9 CA
Posts: 4,083
Originally Posted by DownInPetaluma
If there was even a tiny hint of tire cornering force after touchdown there would be a slight, perhaps imperceptible upwind weathervaning that would be enough to split the reverse vector and get the airplane moving downwind. If you look closely there is a drift to the right, correction to the left, increase in reverse, and finally the complete swing into the wind as the tail is pushed by the increasing vector and wind itself.
All true- what you said. Could be any one of us, unfortunately.
All true- what you said. Could be any one of us, unfortunately.
11-13-2019, 08:38 AM
#96
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Joined APC: Dec 2012
Position: Arrgh Jay
Posts: 350
Originally Posted by pangolin
Assuming you had presence of mind and the manual dexterity to do it could you decrease the reverse thrust on the side you are sliding toward?
What you’ve described has been tried unsuccessfully in recent times with a similar outcome to this crew’s.
11-13-2019, 10:20 AM
#99
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Joined APC: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,083
Originally Posted by DownInPetaluma
Not recommended. Both reversers have the split component with any weathervane. I would take both to idle reverse and probably out of reverse altogether. Heck, even a little forward thrust is actually recommended if it’s getting way out of hand. (Disclosure: not an Envoy pilot and not speaking for any training curriculum in general)
What you’ve described has been tried unsuccessfully in recent times with a similar outcome to this crew’s.
What you’ve described has been tried unsuccessfully in recent times with a similar outcome to this crew’s.
11-13-2019, 11:05 AM
#100
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Joined APC: Jan 2017
Posts: 2,510
Originally Posted by Bruno82
Those are the days I wonder why they closed 32L and 32R.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Give them a few years and they will be tearing up and building again.
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