Furlough Protection
#11
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2016
Posts: 2,465
So the big question is whether Envoy or any other WO falls under the same protections as their mainline owners with these bailouts and grants.
Might be hard for AAG to argue with epays showing where your pay checks come from. Something ALPA should be looking into at a DC level for sure.
wish everyone the best through this.
Might be hard for AAG to argue with epays showing where your pay checks come from. Something ALPA should be looking into at a DC level for sure.
wish everyone the best through this.
#12
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2019
Posts: 413
Im not even sure, we are “Envoy Air Inc” not even “Envoy Airlines”.. as some would say, we’re a staffing agency and ground handling service.
#13
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2019
Posts: 226
So the big question is whether Envoy or any other WO falls under the same protections as their mainline owners with these bailouts and grants.
Might be hard for AAG to argue with epays showing where your pay checks come from. Something ALPA should be looking into at a DC level for sure.
wish everyone the best through this.
Might be hard for AAG to argue with epays showing where your pay checks come from. Something ALPA should be looking into at a DC level for sure.
wish everyone the best through this.
Although I do hope we are covered under this.
#14
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2017
Posts: 546
I’m not sure how specifically the law will be interpreted on this case, but PR risk for AAG is probably larger than its worth. The cost savings of furloughing a few hundred or even a thousand or two regional pilots is minimal compared to the risk of coming under fire for taking government money and then furloughing under some loophole corporate structure.
Obviously, this is just my opinion, but I doubt this is the last help AAG will need from Congress before this nightmare is over. I don’t think they want to bite the hand that feeds them right now.
Obviously, this is just my opinion, but I doubt this is the last help AAG will need from Congress before this nightmare is over. I don’t think they want to bite the hand that feeds them right now.
#16
I’m not sure how specifically the law will be interpreted on this case, but PR risk for AAG is probably larger than its worth. The cost savings of furloughing a few hundred or even a thousand or two regional pilots is minimal compared to the risk of coming under fire for taking government money and then furloughing under some loophole corporate structure.
Obviously, this is just my opinion, but I doubt this is the last help AAG will need from Congress before this nightmare is over. I don’t think they want to bite the hand that feeds them right now.
Obviously, this is just my opinion, but I doubt this is the last help AAG will need from Congress before this nightmare is over. I don’t think they want to bite the hand that feeds them right now.
^^ This 1000%. Couldnt have said it better
#17
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2018
Position: Resigned
Posts: 1,547
#18
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2017
Posts: 3,656
If the company was smart they would offer low paying leave time. If they offered something like AA’s 40-50 hour lines people would bid them I for one can’t afford to have no income though.
#19
Their options are:
#1: Take the grants, use the money to keep employees mostly intact (minus voluntary cutbacks, VLOA's, etc).
Advantage: Free money to preserve capacity in case they need it later this year. Good PR.
Disadvantage: What if the grant $ is not enough to cover payroll costs for idle employees? That get's to #2...
#2: Pass on the grants, and manage their own way out it. If the grants don't cover payroll, they would be financially better off in the short-term taking no grants, and immediately taking a weed-whacker to rank-and-file labor. It still might be worth it to take the grants and pay the delta out of pocket to preserve capacity IF they think they're going to need it soon...
But if they're concerned about near-term cash bleed-out and BK, they may not be able to afford to pay ANYTHING above the grants to preserve capacity that might or might not be needed soon.
Also it's possible that the answer could be different for AA vs. the WO's... I think they are sufficiently arms-length that each operating company could make their own decision without affecting the others.
For AA, I'm sure they'll take the grant... if they're still bleeding from the arteries and about to bleed out in a few months, they'll just ask for more aid, AA is too big to liquidate. WO's don't qualify in that regard.
#20
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2018
Position: Resigned
Posts: 1,547
I don't think anyone read the question, they just read my answer. The question was why would they want to furlough still, and the answer is free money. I don't know if they can. Maybe, probably not. If they test it by furloughing WO regional employees to save a couple bucks (we're basically free anyway and they only have to wait until October) it'll get litigated. However unlikely it is, it wouldn't surprise me, AA likes to chase small money.
I think banking on a second bailout just for American because they are the only airline that can't make money even when times are good is pretty far out.
For my part, I'm less afraid of being furloughed from the Voy and more afraid of APA giving up scope relief to keep the music going a little while longer. No business can operate at a loss forever. Management is going to want to focus on things where they know they can make money. Like regional seat miles.
edit: made it clearer
I think banking on a second bailout just for American because they are the only airline that can't make money even when times are good is pretty far out.
For my part, I'm less afraid of being furloughed from the Voy and more afraid of APA giving up scope relief to keep the music going a little while longer. No business can operate at a loss forever. Management is going to want to focus on things where they know they can make money. Like regional seat miles.
edit: made it clearer
Last edited by NoValueAviator; 03-27-2020 at 10:46 AM.
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