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Old 03-29-2020 | 11:45 AM
  #51  
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Originally Posted by highfarfast
The point I was trying to make is that AA and APA and Envoy management can't just do it. WE would have to approve it here as would those at the other WO separately. Been seeing a few posts in various threads that seem to indicate some people think flowbacks can become a thing without our agreeing to it.

But I will say to the point your making about my choice of words:
Our MEC has shown in the past to have a significantly different view on what is a significant change. Current leadership has so far been a bit more transparent than in the past so perhaps that will be different going forward. We'll see.
Yes, the MEC’s have always played fast and furious with the word significant in the past. I don’t see that happening with this MEC. You’ve got good officers, and mostly very good reps. I think they are working well on behalf of the pilots. I don’t give praise easilly unless earned; they’ve earned it.
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Old 03-29-2020 | 11:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Cujo665
They'd face an immediate lawsuit, DFR and injunction from current Envoy Pilots, most of whom would be displaced, CA to FO, and FO to furloughed.
Yes, and that's why flowbacks won't happen.
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Old 03-30-2020 | 06:44 PM
  #53  
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Originally Posted by blackbox348
Do we have furlough protection from the bailout? I’ve heard different things.
Has anyone figured this out yet? Do wholly owned have the October 1st furlough protection if mainline take the grants? Can regionals apply directly for the grants?
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Old 03-30-2020 | 09:20 PM
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Originally Posted by wwood
Has anyone figured this out yet? Do wholly owned have the October 1st furlough protection if mainline take the grants? Can regionals apply directly for the grants?
There are news stories circulating that state an email was sent to AA pilots stating Parker intended to take the bailouts that protected their jobs. I do find it curious that we have not gotten any such email. Maybe it means nothing maybe it means something. I dunno. I don't think we're out of the woods for sure until Envoy starts new hire classes again.
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Old 03-30-2020 | 09:30 PM
  #55  
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Originally Posted by highfarfast
There are news stories circulating that state an email was sent to AA pilots stating Parker intended to take the bailouts that protected their jobs. I do find it curious that we have not gotten any such email. Maybe it means nothing maybe it means something. I dunno. I don't think we're out of the woods for sure until Envoy starts new hire classes again.
Isom and Parker sent out an email to AA team members saying they are applying for it.
This happened today so Envoy hasn't had a chance to evaluate the situation yet.
"We intend to apply for these funds and are confident that, along with our relatively high available cash position, they will allow us to fly through even the worst of potential future scenarios. Importantly to our team members, these funds include payroll assistance that ensures no involuntary furloughs or cuts in pay rates or benefits for the next six months."
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Old 03-30-2020 | 09:36 PM
  #56  
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Originally Posted by dera
Isom and Parker sent out an email to AA team members saying they are applying for it.
This happened today so Envoy hasn't had a chance to evaluate the situation yet.
"We intend to apply for these funds and are confident that, along with our relatively high available cash position, they will allow us to fly through even the worst of potential future scenarios. Importantly to our team members, these funds include payroll assistance that ensures no involuntary furloughs or cuts in pay rates or benefits for the next six months."
None of that refutes what I said.
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Old 03-30-2020 | 09:37 PM
  #57  
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Originally Posted by highfarfast
None of that refutes what I said.
I wasn't refuting anything you said, just provided the text that AA sent to their guys.
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Old 03-30-2020 | 09:51 PM
  #58  
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Originally Posted by dera
I wasn't refuting anything you said, just provided the text that AA sent to their guys.
Ah... OK. Hopefully, we'll get a similar email. That said, I don't think I'd trust it until Envoy starts hiring again.
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Old 03-31-2020 | 04:56 AM
  #59  
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Originally Posted by highfarfast
I do find it curious that we have not gotten any such email.
Because they don't care about you or your feelings, and have their lawyers looking at what they can and can't do.

It's certainly a risky move to take taxpayer money and furlough the taxpayers, after agreeing they wouldn't, them using lawyer language to circumnavigate.

So can AA find better lawyers than the ones who drafted the bill, and can they settle the lawsuit cheaper than 5 months of payroll.
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Old 04-02-2020 | 06:10 AM
  #60  
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Originally Posted by But seriously
I’m not sure how specifically the law will be interpreted on this case, but PR risk for AAG is probably larger than its worth. The cost savings of furloughing a few hundred or even a thousand or two regional pilots is minimal compared to the risk of coming under fire for taking government money and then furloughing under some loophole corporate structure.

Obviously, this is just my opinion, but I doubt this is the last help AAG will need from Congress before this nightmare is over. I don’t think they want to bite the hand that feeds them right now.
They would never come under fire. Envoy Air Inc would furlough their own pilots. The headlines would be no different than Mesa Airlines or Commutair furloughing, or Compass/Trans States going out of business. American would clarify and say that they did not furlough a single employee, but unfortunately one of their regional partners made a business decision to furlough in order to preserve cash.
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