JustAsking

Sorry if some of this is repetitive, but many of the threads are so dated or have gone down rabbit holes its hard to find current information. Basically, I am wondering what the real, current situation with pilots at Envoy is. Before Coronavirus, envoy had shortages and mandatory Captain upgrades. Are we back to pilot shortages, with all pilots wanting to return back now? And has enough time passed to see what affect the last 12 months had on seniority (particularly more senior pilots - are they leaving, or sticking it out looking for flow?). Finally, how does bidding for Captain upgrade go, and can you wait to build seniority or is it mandatory and you just get what you get? Do you bid just to upgrade, or do you bid by aircraft, then base?

But seriously

filler.......

pitchattitude

If one looks at those leaving, it is PRIMARILY senior FOs leaving to ACMI and ULLCs. There are a FEW that are leaving to majors whether be UAL/DAL/FDX/UPS. Those few that are leaving to a major are likely prior military that weren’t current or very low time when they came here or had some other “distinguishing” qualifier. There are VERY few leaving that are line holding captains, which if you align all the data says those facts still aren’t favoring off the street hiring of regional captains. We’ll see what the next six months really holds as new applications at the majors of that group gets looked at.

Because of this lull, and displacements, the seniority list has very much stratified. There are plenty of FOs with the flight time to upgrade but not seniority to do so. Those are primarily the ones leaving. There MAY come a time a few years down the road where this lull in hiring catches up to those leaving and ENY doesn’t have enough qualified FOs. That could lead to DECs again, since ENY has been lagging everyone else in hiring, and that could lead to forced upgrades, but you are looking at way down the road.

When you bid for upgrade, you are bidding for a base and an aircraft. But that base and aircraft has to be available to get it. Let’s say you want to be a 175 captain in ORD. It can be on your bid, but there has to be a vacancy. You can’t just say I want to be a 175 captain or I want to be a captain in DFW. Your bid has to be base and equipment. But you can easily put your bid in to include both aircraft in DFW or all three bases in 175 and you will end up with what is available if your seniority can hold something you bid.

Pgus

How senior is Miami on the FO side? can a FNG hold it out of training? TIA.

BigZ

things change, but currently junior enough. Provided you get a 175, which is not a given by any stretch of imagination, because if you are on 145 you won't see MIA until you upgrade.

Pgus

Thanks BigZ, are there seat locks? Or can you bid the other aircraft right away?

dera

FOs cant bid jet to jet.
If you get 145 as a new hire, you will stay as a 145 FO until you upgrade or they park the fleet.

Cujo665

or displace you from the base in a downsize, or close the base and displace you.

Varsity

If you aren't coming back from an LOA or a cadet with significant longevity, chances of being on the E145 are .. high.

Pedro4President

I agree with pretty much everything except forced upgrades. They will happen again. Senior FOs on the 175 will realize they can make almost as much as a junior CA on the 145 and stay put. 145 FOs will have high attrition and struggle to gain 1000 hours.

Everyone hired right now will be forced to upgrade.