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-   -   Envoy 2022: The Flow of Charlie Bucket (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/envoy-airlines/136201-envoy-2022-flow-charlie-bucket.html)

dera 02-08-2022 10:38 PM


Originally Posted by FurloughFodder (Post 3369102)
Just had a PO a month or two ago plus a few more in the past 12 months. Not sure why you’re trying to paint the DFW CPO in a bad light when the overwhelming majority of DFW guys are thankful for AE and SL.

It's not really a CPO issue, it's the wicked witch of crew scheduling, JE and the "if I only had a brain" RW, who are the authors of most of the pain that pilots suffer. CPO can not override a day with insufficient coverage, they tried a few years ago and were stomped down. I can give you literally hundreds of examples of denied POs or PEs when staffing was inadequate, including things like funerals for family members who do not qualify for a BR. CPO wants to help, but they do not have the authority to do so. I'm not faulting them.

The main issue is the lack of authority at CPOs, RW and JE are the real problems. AE and especially SL are good people who do what they can. It's nuts how some people treat SL like crap (I've seen pilots hang up the phone on her). She is one of the most well connected people at the whole airline.

cr700 02-09-2022 05:59 AM


Originally Posted by dera (Post 3369310)
It's not really a CPO issue, it's the wicked witch of crew scheduling, JE and the "if I only had a brain" RW, who are the authors of most of the pain that pilots suffer. CPO can not override a day with insufficient coverage, they tried a few years ago and were stomped down. I can give you literally hundreds of examples of denied POs or PEs when staffing was inadequate, including things like funerals for family members who do not qualify for a BR. CPO wants to help, but they do not have the authority to do so. I'm not faulting them.

The main issue is the lack of authority at CPOs, RW and JE are the real problems. AE and especially SL are good people who do what they can. It's nuts how some people treat SL like crap (I've seen pilots hang up the phone on her). She is one of the most well connected people at the whole airline.

I really don't get ex reps leaving the company and coming back here to dispense their breadth of knowledge. You and another one who left some years ago think you are like Gandalf in Lord of the Rings with your wisdom and that everyone at Envoy needs it. It comes across as extremely petty and in addition it's very obvious you are realizing what a bad decision it was to leave.

Go ahead and get started with these "hundreds of examples" because you are first, not telling anywhere near the whole story. Secondly, you totally fabricate other things per whatever grievance you might have with the company. Face it. You left the flow for what, yeah, we know.

Fact. You don't work here and this information you are pushing here is bogus.

APCbot 02-09-2022 07:38 AM


Originally Posted by cr700 (Post 3369389)
I really don't get ex reps leaving the company and coming back here to dispense their breadth of knowledge. You and another one who left some years ago think you are like Gandalf in Lord of the Rings with your wisdom and that everyone at Envoy needs it. It comes across as extremely petty and in addition it's very obvious you are realizing what a bad decision it was to leave.

Go ahead and get started with these "hundreds of examples" because you are first, not telling anywhere near the whole story. Secondly, you totally fabricate other things per whatever grievance you might have with the company. Face it. You left the flow for what, yeah, we know.

Fact. You don't work here and this information you are pushing here is bogus.

Is that like flowing to American and still posting here? Pot meet kettle.

dera 02-09-2022 08:01 AM


Originally Posted by cr700 (Post 3369389)
I really don't get ex reps leaving the company and coming back here to dispense their breadth of knowledge. You and another one who left some years ago think you are like Gandalf in Lord of the Rings with your wisdom and that everyone at Envoy needs it. It comes across as extremely petty and in addition it's very obvious you are realizing what a bad decision it was to leave.

Go ahead and get started with these "hundreds of examples" because you are first, not telling anywhere near the whole story. Secondly, you totally fabricate other things per whatever grievance you might have with the company. Face it. You left the flow for what, yeah, we know.

Fact. You don't work here and this information you are pushing here is bogus.

Gandalf is accurate, I have so much time off my beard game is pretty strong these days.

Cujo665 02-09-2022 09:38 AM


Originally Posted by cr700 (Post 3368176)
Yes, the hypothetical Bucket would flow this week. When you take the Covid pause into consideration, you get a 5 year flow. Exactly as advertised.

5.5… but who’s counting. The only people that had a shot at the 5 year flow were hired in early 2015. The flow rate has been shrinking ever since. At one time it was 50% of every new hire AA position. That was the flow that cleaned the place out fast, after that it has been a gradually diminishing monthly flow, while AA has been steadily increasing classes and class sizes.

the only reason you may stay under a 7 year flow is because United is hiring more of your pilots than AA is.

Cujo665 02-09-2022 09:42 AM


Originally Posted by cr700 (Post 3369389)
I really don't get ex reps leaving the company and coming back here to dispense their breadth of knowledge. You and another one who left some years ago think you are like Gandalf in Lord of the Rings with your wisdom and that everyone at Envoy needs it. It comes across as extremely petty and in addition it's very obvious you are realizing what a bad decision it was to leave.

Go ahead and get started with these "hundreds of examples" because you are first, not telling anywhere near the whole story. Secondly, you totally fabricate other things per whatever grievance you might have with the company. Face it. You left the flow for what, yeah, we know.

Fact. You don't work here and this information you are pushing here is bogus.

Theyll both be at legacies long before they’d have ever flowed. It’s you that are out of touch with industry hiring. Be one of several thousand RJ drivers applying at a legacy, or be a former RJ driver currently flying heavy metal globally applying at the legacy. Guess who gets called first…..
here ends the free lesson.

pitchattitude 02-09-2022 11:31 AM


Originally Posted by cr700 (Post 3369389)
I really don't get ex reps leaving the company and coming back here to dispense their breadth of knowledge. You and another one who left some years ago think you are like Gandalf in Lord of the Rings with your wisdom and that everyone at Envoy needs it. It comes across as extremely petty and in addition it's very obvious you are realizing what a bad decision it was to leave.

Go ahead and get started with these "hundreds of examples" because you are first, not telling anywhere near the whole story. Secondly, you totally fabricate other things per whatever grievance you might have with the company. Face it. You left the flow for what, yeah, we know.

Fact. You don't work here and this information you are pushing here is bogus.

It is a fact that Dera no longer works at Envoy, but his knowledge of the contract is exceeded by few, if any. Most of the pilots at Envoy DO need, and have benefited from, his knowledge.

YOU certainly have added NOTHING that is beneficial to any pilot, current, past or future. You are a management shill that hides behind a screen name. Almost everyone knows who Dera is and he has done nothing he needs to hide from.

pitchattitude 02-09-2022 06:04 PM


Originally Posted by cr700 (Post 3369389)
I really don't get ex reps leaving the company and coming back here to dispense their breadth of knowledge. You and another one who left some years ago think you are like Gandalf in Lord of the Rings with your wisdom and that everyone at Envoy needs it. It comes across as extremely petty and in addition it's very obvious you are realizing what a bad decision it was to leave.

Go ahead and get started with these "hundreds of examples" because you are first, not telling anywhere near the whole story. Secondly, you totally fabricate other things per whatever grievance you might have with the company. Face it. You left the flow for what, yeah, we know.

Fact. You don't work here and this information you are pushing here is bogus.

So, apparently the overwhelming majority of Envoy pilots, by about 2 to 1, feel pretty much what I said about being taken care of.

Or you going to just talk about that small minority that think things are OK-ish?

And while the company does seem to at least acknowledge there is a dumpster fire, they are happy to just let it burn instead of doing anything to even contain it, let alone put it out.

Chato 02-09-2022 06:32 PM


Originally Posted by pitchattitude (Post 3369826)

And while the company does seem to at least acknowledge there is a dumpster fire, they are happy to just let it burn instead of doing anything to even contain it, let alone put it out.

When you dont know what to do, you do nothing.

ExGoCeo2001 02-10-2022 10:06 AM


Originally Posted by cr700 (Post 3369011)
Thanks for posting this. It's nice to see someone speak the truth here and what you've just stated is absolutely what happens. You'd never know it reading some of the posts here however.

I can give you far more stories of denials for important life events than approvals, heck you might even be the one who denied someone a PO to attend an ultrasound with their wife or were you to busy investigating a 1 minute delay for the king CW


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