The useful Envoy thread
08-26-2014 | 04:47 PM
#861
Line Holder
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 631
Likes: 3
So I have a question. One would presume a great number of pilots at mainline American Airlines are flow through from Eagle. Why are they not helping in the fight? Leveraging their power to influence better conditions for you Envoy guys?
Just three months the industry finally took a stand and we making substantial ground for better conditions. Im just amazed how quickly things have change.
Just three months the industry finally took a stand and we making substantial ground for better conditions. Im just amazed how quickly things have change.
08-26-2014 | 05:42 PM
#862
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 1,602
Likes: 0
From: Square root of the variance and average of the variation
Just got an email from the company reminding me not to participate in an illegal work action this weekend. Thought that had fizzled out. They're sufficiently worried about it to send us all an email?
08-26-2014 | 06:18 PM
#863
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 2,035
Likes: 0
08-26-2014 | 08:11 PM
#867
"N2, 40 Precent"
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 40
Likes: 0
Jesus, every single time the negotiations fail the sky immediately starts falling.
PDT will likely accept the deal, it gives them a raise, a future and a slim shot at an AA position.
I'm solidifying my opinion that AAG doesn't really want to negotiate with us. They just keep taking shots at us to keep the others in line, but I also wonder if there's an ulterior motive to these "failed" negotiations, crappy schedules, and self-induced staffing problems. Are they trying to set up some contrived situation to present in court at a future time? I don't generally subscribe to conspiracies, but the wastefulness and lack of any real concern on the company's part about envoy would lead me to think that they have other plans.
PDT will likely accept the deal, it gives them a raise, a future and a slim shot at an AA position.
I'm solidifying my opinion that AAG doesn't really want to negotiate with us. They just keep taking shots at us to keep the others in line, but I also wonder if there's an ulterior motive to these "failed" negotiations, crappy schedules, and self-induced staffing problems. Are they trying to set up some contrived situation to present in court at a future time? I don't generally subscribe to conspiracies, but the wastefulness and lack of any real concern on the company's part about envoy would lead me to think that they have other plans.
AA ~10,000 Pilots
US ~ 5,000 Pilots
~ Half of both groups over the age of 55
United and Delta and all the rest starting to hire.
Management does not want us to stay. They need us to flow. Thus the failed negotiations & crappy schedules.
You are right Sir!!!!
08-26-2014 | 10:01 PM
#869
"N2, 40 Precent"
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 40
Likes: 0
I have been sitting back and reading this thread for a while and not posting much. But I have finally come to the conclusion that we all just need to forget about Envoy and the regional industry and embrace the fact that as Envoy pilots we are, at some point in our careers, going to be sitting in the right seat, and someday the left seat, of a Airbus, 737, 767, 787, A350, or a 777 with the name American painted on the side. Like I suggested in the post above, this is the only play that makes any sense. This is why they keep banging on us so hard by refusing to negotiate. The company does not want us to stay at Envoy. They need us to help staff that big mac daddy of a profit machine called American. Just read between the lines of the letter that the NYC LEC sent out and was posted on this thread. The company can easily place any large RJ on our current contract and still achieve the cost savings they desire but instead they do everything they can sabotage any agreement our MEC comes up with.
Instead, what the company sees is a deep pool of very experienced aviators that they do not have to go through the hassle of hiring of the street. If they made things better at Envoy, some will want to stay. They don't want that. It's going to be "all hands on deck" over at mainline in a couple of years. So in my view, the company can send as many of our large RJ's to as many of our cheap competitors as they want because in the long run it won't matter to us; we'll be jerking gear handles over at mainline.
Instead, what the company sees is a deep pool of very experienced aviators that they do not have to go through the hassle of hiring of the street. If they made things better at Envoy, some will want to stay. They don't want that. It's going to be "all hands on deck" over at mainline in a couple of years. So in my view, the company can send as many of our large RJ's to as many of our cheap competitors as they want because in the long run it won't matter to us; we'll be jerking gear handles over at mainline.
Last edited by IDG99; 08-26-2014 at 10:13 PM. Reason: Spelling
08-27-2014 | 05:04 AM
#870
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 338
Likes: 0
From: 737 FO
The funny thing is that they want us to leave, but on their timetable. They are limiting the Flow Throughs to 20 a month even though it should be 25. They would prefer we take a pay cut during our time remaining here as well.
While I appreciate your optimism re: left seat of something bigger, there is a large group of us Envoy pilots who likely won't see it. I've got almost 15 years here, and by the time I flow through I doubt I'll see left seat prior to retirement. For some guys here, it's just not worth it...
While I appreciate your optimism re: left seat of something bigger, there is a large group of us Envoy pilots who likely won't see it. I've got almost 15 years here, and by the time I flow through I doubt I'll see left seat prior to retirement. For some guys here, it's just not worth it...
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