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Shiner 11-22-2016 08:14 AM

For everyone complaining about the schedules, again I'll reference a letter from our own union scheduling committee sent out yesterday which says, "I mentioned last month that I was “cautiously optimistic” regarding our schedules moving into 2017.

I am upgrading that outlook to optimistic. See below."

Our own committee is optimistic that these atrocious schedules are being worked on and phased out by AAG and Envoy. The large pay increases were an immediate fix and improving the schedules is taking some time, but stop acting like things are hopeless here when clearly improvements are on the way.

Below is more excerpts from the letter:



Pairing Generation
During Pairing Generation, we put in a great deal of effort attempting to introduce variety into the CRJ and 175 lines.

On the 175, we tried many different studies to push 2 days, 3 days, a combination of 2s and 3s, as well as a 4-day study. Of the various studies, the combination approach looked most promising but they ended up being too weak to stand on their own in lines. The 4 day only study gave us the highest block per day at 4:25, the highest it has been in a while so we went with that knowing that it would give us less 2 days off, more commutability, and more cadent lines. The 175 continues to improve and I’m hoping to see some variety soon.

The CRJ had 3 day trips that were relatively strong, but in the end the 3 day sequences had to be mixed in with the 4 days.

Line Build
ERJ - We were able to get variety in both bases!
o DFW: 6 – 2 day lines, 20 – 3 day lines, 2 or less occurrences of 2 days off in the 4 day lines.

o ORD: 5 – 2 day lines / 27 – 3 day lines / it has more occurrences of 2 days off than DFW.


CRJ – As mentioned above, the 3 days had to be mixed with the 4 days. The planning department was able to work with the company to reduce the frequency of 30 hour overnights which resulted in an overall increase in 3 day off events, and improved start and end times for commuters.

175 – Out of 95 lines, 69 have at least 2 sets of 3 days off and only 8 are strictly 4 on 2 off.

We had some welcome improvements to the ERJ lines, as well as some smaller steps in the right direction for the CRJ and 175. I am encouraged that we had some progress in December as it is historically one of the most difficult scheduling months.

Many of the emails I received this month seem to follow the same theme: Where’s the variety? And, why all of the 4 days?

These questions go hand in hand. As you all know our average block per day has been weak for some time. If the 2 and 3 day sequences are weak, they cannot be put into lines that reach the 72-hour guarantee and still honor the contractual 11 days off. When we were in a staffing surplus, the company allowed lines to drop below guarantee, but that is no longer the case.

Generally speaking, a 4-day trip is the most productive. With the block per day being as low as it has been this past year, the prevalence of the 4-day trip is the natural result. Seeing nothing but 4 day lines in your bid packet is not so much a choice, but a last resort.

I mentioned last month that I was “cautiously optimistic” regarding our schedules moving into 2017.

I am upgrading that outlook to optimistic. See below.

Other News:
As a result of Envoy Crew Planning meeting with AAG Strategic Network Planning, many issues in the flight file are being corrected, which is great news. However, many of these changes will not be seen until after the Dec. 15 schedule change or in January. “Improvements” come in many forms, but here are some of the problem cites that should benefit:

ERJ: FWA, CAK, ROW, LRD, ORF, TRC, JAN, ALO, BMI, and GSO (in January)
CRJ: BNA and CID
175: IND, YUL, and YYC should see improvements in January.

These are pieces to the puzzle that do not represent the whole picture but are a considerable step in the right direction. Some of the benefits are already being seen in the December lines despite only going into effect in the second half of the month.

The Crew Planning Department is making a bit of a personnel shift with the ERJ planner stepping into a more forward looking role. When the rest of the planners are working on the January build, she will be looking as far ahead as March attempting to head off potential problems with the file and continue to seek improvements for Envoy. This will result in some shifting of responsibilities within the department and will no doubt come with some challenges in the spool up process. Regardless, it is refreshing to see the company attempt to “get ahead of the airplane” with the schedule and also for them to be afforded the opportunity to do so by AAG.

As always, your emails and input are welcome. Thank you to those that have reached out to us.

Wishing you an early Happy Thanksgiving!

Smutter 11-22-2016 09:00 AM


Originally Posted by Shiner (Post 2248044)
For everyone complaining about the schedules, again I'll reference a letter from our own union scheduling committee sent out yesterday which says, "I mentioned last month that I was “cautiously optimistic” regarding our schedules moving into 2017.

I am upgrading that outlook to optimistic. See below."

Our own committee is optimistic that these atrocious schedules are being worked on and phased out by AAG and Envoy. The large pay increases were an immediate fix and improving the schedules is taking some time, but stop acting like things are hopeless here when clearly improvements are on the way.

Below is more excerpts from the letter:

OK, so when they fix them we'll stop complaining. For three years we have been told the same thing about January.

What happens if we didn't come on here and complain, or call reps to *****, or tell the company how we feel, nothing would've happened then. Which technically hasn't happened, so after three years we're still complaining, and maybe the company will get to it.

Maybe they shouldn't have cut our pay to low, or maybe they shouldn't have given our schedules away with AC. Now they're paying more then they needed to, and having to fix schedules that they think are fine.

So yes, we will continue to complain, because nothing has changed. Usairways was a horrible company the day Parker took over, and that continued when he took over AA, what will change, probably Jan and Feb schedules, where flying is low, then back to crap by May.

For those that say Pedro is a cheerleader for this company.
He put people in Charge of the ramp, they cut levels, and ramp has been terrible ever since.
Pedro, put ric in place, what happened, flight operations fell apart.
Pedro, placed people in charge of scheduling, what happened, scheduling is Satan's pit.
Remember when Pedro said give me what I need and I'll get all pilots numbers at AA, how'd that go. Parker laughed his ass out of the office.

Shiner 11-22-2016 09:16 AM

I get it. The last few years have been rough. It's time to turn the page, man.

I'm signing out of here for a while, enjoy the Holiday everyone, whether with your family or with your crew.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

ORDinary 11-22-2016 09:43 AM


Originally Posted by Shiner (Post 2247751)
You must live local and be fairly senior. I can see bidding reserve to avoid 4 day trips until more day trip and 2 day lines come back.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I do live local, but I wouldn't call myself senior. I'll never be able to hold 2 day or 3 day trips. There are ~180 ORD EMJ CA and about 60 are lifers who bypassed flow. I wouldn't mind doing 4 days sometimes if there were 3 days off in between. But 4 on/2 off, never.

Pedro4President 11-22-2016 09:49 AM


Originally Posted by ORDinary (Post 2248117)
I do live local, but I wouldn't call myself senior. I'll never be able to hold 2 day or 3 day trips. There are ~180 ORD EMJ CA and about 60 are lifers who bypassed flow. I wouldn't mind doing 4 days sometimes if there were 3 days off in between. But 4 on/2 off, never.

Do know you know how many "FO till I flow" guys you have in ORD. I know we have at least 5 that I know in DFW that won't upgrade and just wait for the flow. There maybe more guys waiting to upgrade straight into holding a line and bypassing CA reserve.

ORDinary 11-22-2016 10:02 AM


Originally Posted by Pedro4President (Post 2248119)
Do know you know how many "FO till I flow" guys you have in ORD. I know we have at least 5 that I know in DFW that won't upgrade and just wait for the flow. There maybe more guys waiting to upgrade straight into holding a line and bypassing CA reserve.

I've flown with a few recently in ORD who told me they don't think they want to upgrade here but aren't sure. Then I tell them a few of my experiences with Scheduling on reserve and they say they are certain. Holding a line isn't much better because the junior lines (which is like 2/3 of them) are just awful, like we've never seen here before.

cr700 11-22-2016 12:38 PM


Originally Posted by Shiner (Post 2248044)
For everyone complaining about the schedules, again I'll reference a letter from our own union scheduling committee sent out yesterday which says, "I mentioned last month that I was “cautiously optimistic” regarding our schedules moving into 2017.

I am upgrading that outlook to optimistic. See below."

Our own committee is optimistic that these atrocious schedules are being worked on and phased out by AAG and Envoy. The large pay increases were an immediate fix and improving the schedules is taking some time, but stop acting like things are hopeless here when clearly improvements are on the way.

Below is more excerpts from the letter:

This right here proves my point from a couple days back regarding improvement in the flight file and schedule improvements reflected in January/February.

ORDinary 11-22-2016 12:59 PM


Originally Posted by cr700 (Post 2248215)
This right here proves my point from a couple days back regarding improvement in the flight file and schedule improvements reflected in January/February.

Your main point a couple days back was that us whiny pilots were exaggerating the scheduling problems. Are you still sticking to your claim that 40/mo will be flowing starting in January?

cr700 11-22-2016 01:19 PM


Originally Posted by ORDinary (Post 2248231)
Your main point a couple days back was that us whiny pilots were exaggerating the scheduling problems. Are you still sticking to your claim that 40/mo will be flowing starting in January?

Yes, I stand by the "largely exaggerated" statement. And AAG has stated they want 40 per month starting in 2017. I fully expect that as it was stated at the same time the bonuses were implemented.

moon 11-22-2016 01:22 PM


Originally Posted by cr700 (Post 2248244)
Yes, I stand by the "largely exaggerated" statement. And AAG has stated they want 40 per month starting in 2017. I fully expect that as it was stated at the same time the bonuses were implemented.

Don't personally see it happening, but hope you are right. That would lift spirits here a lot.


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