Got the CJO. Thoughts about Xjet ?
01-13-2020 | 03:25 PM
#51
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I’m not trying to step on toes, Ivan......but I think when a CPP/AVIATE candidate fails the process, and then leaves for another carrier........doesn’t bother UAL in the slightest. They clearly decided against them for a reason (fair or unfair, not for me to speak on). More senior and mid-level pilots leave, and are replaced with cheaper new hires. I 100% understand your frustration, and I know you care about the pilots you represent. Your comment that the CPP was a “disaster” has a LOT to do with perspective. I consider it the best thing that ever happened to me, professionally. I know it wasn’t “fair”, but that’s ALSO a matter of perspective.
Meanwhile, there's probably plenty that would have made it through an OTS that were never selected as such yet shot down in the CPP. The process proved to be less consistent/more inconsistent that straight OTS it seems.
Said it before, many had ZERO problems getting hired elsewhere. And not because they suddenly did anything radically different.
Ivan doesn't sugar coat things, but he for sure calls it like is.
You'd just think they'd have it down to a better system by now.
01-13-2020 | 04:57 PM
#52
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And there's no rime or reason how they choose. Many wouldn't have even been granted an interview had it not been for the CPP.
Meanwhile, there's probably plenty that would have made it through an OTS that were never selected as such yet shot down in the CPP. The process proved to be less consistent/more inconsistent that straight OTS it seems.
Said it before, many had ZERO problems getting hired elsewhere. And not because they suddenly did anything radically different.
Ivan doesn't sugar coat things, but he for sure calls it like is.
And in the process pass on a lot of great pilots. As you said, fair or unfair.
You'd just think they'd have it down to a better system by now.
Meanwhile, there's probably plenty that would have made it through an OTS that were never selected as such yet shot down in the CPP. The process proved to be less consistent/more inconsistent that straight OTS it seems.
Said it before, many had ZERO problems getting hired elsewhere. And not because they suddenly did anything radically different.
Ivan doesn't sugar coat things, but he for sure calls it like is.
And in the process pass on a lot of great pilots. As you said, fair or unfair.
You'd just think they'd have it down to a better system by now.
United believes they are selecting pilots that will foster a certain culture. It has far more to do with what they are trying to discern from your personality than what type of “pilot” you are. The fact that many who think they killed it in the interview don’t make it while most who do make it fell like they could have done much better is no coincidence. Whether they are good or not at what they are doing is again going to depend highly on perspective, but believing that being a “good pilot” is what should get you the job will only get you disappointment with United. That should be obvious from the fact they are about to start interviewing pilots who just passed their CFI checkride. It’s about the person, not the “pilot.”
01-13-2020 | 05:04 PM
#53
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United believes they are selecting pilots that will foster a certain culture. It has far more to do with what they are trying to discern from your personality than what type of “pilot” you are. The fact that many who think they killed it in the interview don’t make it while most who do make it fell like they could have done much better is no coincidence. Whether they are good or not at what they are doing is again going to depend highly on perspective, but believing that being a “good pilot” is what should get you the job will only get you disappointment with United. That should be obvious from the fact they are about to start interviewing pilots who just passed their CFI checkride. It’s about the person, not the “pilot.”
But feel free to get wrapped around the axel over verbiage. But in this day and age, it's pretty obvious whats meant/being conveyed.
01-13-2020 | 05:34 PM
#54
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I’ll figure women out before I understand these programs . I understand the intent, but how things play out in the real world has me baffled. It’s the lack of consistency that I don’t get. Many of those who didn’t make the cut were weeded out for good reason, but there has also been a bunch of really good people that didn’t get accepted. It doesn’t just seem to be just a couple of good applicants not making the cut, that would be easy to explain. I’m not in the room when interviews are going on, but it seems like more than just a couple are getting cut. You’d think that with those numbers a pattern would show up, but I have yet to find a method to the madness. How does Aviate compare to what Delta is doing in both the method, and the results?
01-13-2020 | 05:54 PM
#55
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I’ll figure women out before I understand these programs . I understand the intent, but how things play out in the real world has me baffled. It’s the lack of consistency that I don’t get. Many of those who didn’t make the cut were weeded out for good reason, but there has also been a bunch of really good people that didn’t get accepted. It doesn’t just seem to be just a couple of good applicants not making the cut, that would be easy to explain. I’m not in the room when interviews are going on, but it seems like more than just a couple are getting cut. You’d think that with those numbers a pattern would show up, but I have yet to find a method to the madness. How does Aviate compare to what Delta is doing in both the method, and the results?
It’s more about navigating their obstacles. Not answering questions exactly per the STAR format, using “strongly” answers too much in the Hogan, answering “Why United?” in ways that could apply to any airline, etc. are all show stoppers. It’s more about playing the game and clearing their hurdles. There are so many ways to screw it up it makes the results seem inconsistent.
01-13-2020 | 07:37 PM
#56
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United believes they are selecting pilots that will foster a certain culture. It has far more to do with what they are trying to discern from your personality than what type of “pilot” you are. The fact that many who think they killed it in the interview don’t make it while most who do make it fell like they could have done much better is no coincidence. Whether they are good or not at what they are doing is again going to depend highly on perspective, but believing that being a “good pilot” is what should get you the job will only get you disappointment with United. That should be obvious from the fact they are about to start interviewing pilots who just passed their CFI checkride. It’s about the person, not the “pilot.”
Heck, passengers often don’t even know their regional pilot isn’t employed by United. To them it’s a plane with the United globe on the back. The lines become even more blurred when you introduce an E-175 on the route.
If United is about the Core 4 and the right person why not interview that way at the regional level like the American and Delta wholly owned’s?
The answer is simple, finding those candidates costs money and it costs commitment to the pilots in the way of flow and stability. United just needs those feeders staffed and can’t be overly picky who they hire.
Once the 737 MAX comes on line and the hiring goes full tilt United will find themselves in a world of hurt with nobody to blame but themselves.
Last edited by Cessna182TypeR; 01-13-2020 at 08:00 PM.
01-14-2020 | 03:26 AM
#57
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If that’s the case why not interview all pilots at XJT (and others) to match this mold? That would foster the same culture all around the United system.
Heck, passengers often don’t even know their regional pilot isn’t employed by United. To them it’s a plane with the United globe on the back. The lines become even more blurred when you introduce an E-175 on the route.
If United is about the Core 4 and the right person why not interview that way at the regional level like the American and Delta wholly owned’s?
The answer is simple, finding those candidates costs money and it costs commitment to the pilots in the way of flow and stability. United just needs those feeders staffed and can’t be overly picky who they hire.
Once the 737 MAX comes on line and the hiring goes full tilt United will find themselves in a world of hurt with nobody to blame but themselves.
Heck, passengers often don’t even know their regional pilot isn’t employed by United. To them it’s a plane with the United globe on the back. The lines become even more blurred when you introduce an E-175 on the route.
If United is about the Core 4 and the right person why not interview that way at the regional level like the American and Delta wholly owned’s?
The answer is simple, finding those candidates costs money and it costs commitment to the pilots in the way of flow and stability. United just needs those feeders staffed and can’t be overly picky who they hire.
Once the 737 MAX comes on line and the hiring goes full tilt United will find themselves in a world of hurt with nobody to blame but themselves.
The only real reason they do it is because they can. There are probably 15-20 qualified applicants per every opening at United while there are probably 0.75 qualified applicants per opening at Express.
01-14-2020 | 05:07 AM
#60
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Joined: Feb 2008
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From: It's a plane and it's a seat
that’s some funny stuff right there. The Legacies have plenty of of applicants to satisfy there needs. The “pilot shortage” will only affect the regionals.
we see it already. DAL flies the A220 to places that have had regional service and I fly the Bus to quite a few of the same places I flew the E145 too.
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