Originally Posted by dckozak

The A plan WAS the crown jewel of our contract in the past. Favorable governance at the federal level has allowed industries in general and Fedex in particular to decimate various safeguards, pay protections and other negotiated "good deals" of organized labor contracts. Fedex's beancounters have seen the annuity based retirement we (uniquely within Fedex) have and seen to it that if we won't negotiate it away, time and inflation will do their job for them. We thought (naively) that we could avoid an A scale, B scale retirement within our pilot force and instead of protecting the pilots on the property with an improvement in our current plan; we have settled for a withering A plan for all pilots, old and new at Fedex.

Yes we did it to ourselves, those of you in the 50% + who voted for it (and would bet many would not admit to it). We all love draft, VAC buytback and many other goodies that are a good deal for the individual, but hamstring the collective. We are our own worse enemies, and Fedex thanks you for it.

Originally Posted by Noworkallplay

And you answered the biggest question of why do we need to look at other formulas. Our current plan is not common anymore bc the rules changed in 2006 Pension Protection Act. Those who didn’t have their pension whipped out by bankruptcy are now left with a pension that is massively expensive and the fundamentals were not built around the new regulations. It’s massively expensive to raise the benefit. You want to fight that fight again and loose be my guest. Oh and guess what no arbitration is ever going to rule in your favor to increase it if it gets to that point. It’s a ticking time bomb about to blow up and leave a bunch of pilots holding the bag going “but they promised me”. Just ask your buddies who lost theirs. Change the equation or loose it bottom line.

Originally Posted by SaltyDog

We started with a 1% DBP, retroactive for 10 years when we started. By law, this required a substantial payment for funding. Retro is very expensive. Thus, unable to reach a 2% as FedEx. So ALPA FedEX pilots have a 2% "whole Life" DB and IPA UPS pilots have a 1% "Whole life" DB.
The workaround? A Flat dollar "Term insurance" plus up that extends beyond the amendable date and captures each group of older pilots. We have don this each successive CBA. Again on this next TA. I can assure you, no IPA pilot as they age will ratify a TA that does not continually increase the DB plan through the flat dollar increase of "term insurance" on top of the "whole life" DB plan.
You appear to think this is band aid approach is a failure. Not sure why ALPA FedEx does not consider this model for you all. It is all on UPS shoulders. I use a B plan for my own retirement risks. Even the "band aid " is absolutely known, even if go out on LTD. No different than current "whole life" DB.
You may think we are the dumb ones, but we have increased it every contract we have since its inception, and by its nature, it will be a required element of increase to pass any TA.
Cheers from a band aid guy.

Originally Posted by FXLAX

Does the new TA flat dollar plan equate to or surpass FedEx’s $130k/yr after 25 YOS for all pilots?

Originally Posted by BoilerUP

No, it does not in 25 YOS; a UPS Captain (for one revenue leg) would need all 30 years of service to exceed the current capped FDX DB max benefit of $130k...in 2023.



We were way behind FDX’s DB plan, and if the extension is passed we’ll be on pace to slightly exceed it in value (admittedly after 5 more years of service).

There’s also the difference in defined contribution percentage, but that’s not explicitly pertinent to a defined benefit discussion.

Originally Posted by USMCFDX

Can you also confirm that your B plan is 12% - which is higher than ours at FedEx. I would say that with the two combined your retirement package is now higher than ours for a Captain at 30 yeas of service, and maybe at 25 YOS due to the higher B fund.

Originally Posted by tnkrdrvr

It is 12%. DC contributions begin with 2d year pay.

Originally Posted by BoilerUP

No, it does not in 25 YOS; a UPS Captain (for one revenue leg) would need all 30 years of service to exceed the current capped FDX DB max benefit of $130k...in 2023.



We were way behind FDX’s DB plan, and if the extension is passed we’ll be on pace to slightly exceed it in value (admittedly after 5 more years of service).

There’s also the difference in defined contribution percentage, but that’s not explicitly pertinent to a defined benefit discussion.

Originally Posted by Noworkallplay

Is your B plan capped?

Originally Posted by Noworkallplay

Another thing I found funny is the people who are posting in opposition to the VB Pension. They have been around FDX for 8-30 years. They had 0 success in the past moving the bar on our current pension. They only got band aid fixes for small portions of the group much like what UPS just did. Yet they thump their chest that they will hold the line. Heck they were part of the group that didn't hold the line the last 2-3 contracts. Do you have confidence in this portion of our group again? Heck these are the same guys who over the past 2 months flew the trips the union encouraged them to take a second look at. Yeh, ive got all the confidence in the world with that group holding the line hahahaha