Originally Posted by FDXAV8R

I keep hearing from a lot of younger guys who are already planning on buying a boat with their "bonus" and all they look at is the pay rates. They are getting to start out as a WB FO and don't realize there is a lot more to a contract than just pay rates. We definitely need to educate these guys. One thing that might be helpful is what happens next if we can finally stand up to FedEx and vote this deal down. Lets finally have a spine like our brothers over at Delta and have the courage to fight for what we have earned. I think unless the union leadership shares our sentiment first thing is they have to go. I hope the yes votes will all just resign. Next we need to get a chairman who actually understands what is like to fly the line month in an month out and isn't interested in jumping across the table next round and working against us like so many have.

Originally Posted by md11freightdog

My question would be...if we send the MEC leadership and the NC packing, who in their right mind is going to want to replace them? Who is going to be willing to volunteered to be put against a wall and have verbal shots thrown at them by the pilots they are offering to help? Our pilots record of ALPA participation in nominations and elections have not exactly been stellar and I doubt there will be many volunteers lining up to participate in the next round of negotiations. Four years of hard work, and I find little gratitude on this forum for the work done and the gains made in the TA up to this point. While some may not agree that the gains were adequate, there ARE gains. While there was no A fund increase, the new hires will be kept in the program, which is basically unheard of anymore in this industry. No PBS, No messing with vacation, pay raises that keep us at the top of the industry (with AA) and a B fund that in 4 years will essentially match SWA 401k match (yes they have profit sharing, but we have a locked in A fund, which is essentially an annuity that would cost between $2-3M to purchase outright depending on age of retirement and survivor benefits.)

I disagree with the international deadhead giveback--it was merely a trade. Give up FC (which is going the way of the dodo bird anyway) and take fully lie flat BC seats (try Cathay--they are superb) and in addition get BC seats on intl deadheads over 2.5 hours. To eliminate the coach DH seats on Emirates from DXB to DEL or BOM is not a concession IMHO.

As a group, I do not think we have the leverage that some would think or wish for. The thought of the company not surviving peak without a signed TA is a pipe dream. For those working here December 2000 will recall the company's request for an additional 2 days per month of work so they could ramp up for the postal contract. The Union presented a proposal to management with multiple requests. Management denied the requests and continued on without the unions help. Guess what--they made it work. Same thing will happen here. Management, I believe, has put enough into this TA where they genuinely believe they can get 50% plus 1 vote. I am sure, however, they have a listed alternate, and are developing contingency plans as we speak in case the TA gets voted down.

Finally, what is the time value of money lost if we go back to the negotiating table? Time to put together a new NC, get the company to agree to a mtg schedule, work with the mediator, and hope like crazy that the next TA (which could easily be 12-24 months down the road) will have enough additional upside to compensate for the lost additional compensation.

I think the NC did the best they could over the past four years. Am I thrilled with every section...of course not. I, like most everyone else, would have liked to see some additional retirement improvements.

In conclusion, to the members of the NC (and those that read this entire post), I only have one thing to say....thank you.

Originally Posted by XprsFr8r

I hope you're just wound up and spouting off out of frustration (which is understandable), but you obviously don't know CD, his background or his commitment to this pilot group. He has taken on a thankless task on behalf of an arguably thankless group of pilots in hopes of getting us the best deal possible. This TA certainly isn't everything I hoped for, but the negotiating committee has invested more time, sweat and tears than me, you or anyone else on this forum, and CD is trying to bring this thing to a satisfactory conclusion. With that in mind, I respectfully suggest you take a deep breath and cease with personal attacks or accusations of hidden agendas. I can assure you CD has no designs on a management position.

Originally Posted by Raptor

I'll second that. As a matter of fact, I hope everyone recalls CD and RZ

Originally Posted by md11freightdog

Finally, what is the time value of money lost if we go back to the negotiating table? Time to put together a new NC, get the company to agree to a mtg schedule, work with the mediator, and hope like crazy that the next TA (which could easily be 12-24 months down the road) will have enough additional upside to compensate for the lost additional compensation.

I think the NC did the best they could over the past four years. Am I thrilled with every section...of course not. I, like most everyone else, would have liked to see some additional retirement improvements.

In conclusion, to the members of the NC (and those that read this entire post), I only have one thing to say....thank you.

Originally Posted by PicklePausePull

Well, let's look at the time value of money. Much was wasted on the first two years of smoke and toke "negotiations." If we don't correct deficiencies now, and don't add significantly to both the A fund and pay, we sacrifice plenty in future value at the end of this contract plus the next 2-4 years of negotiations. It is precisely the time value of money that propels us to fix things now, rather than hope for better returns 6-8 years down the road...