I've done fractional for about 20 years after 5 at the regionals. I don't work at Flex, and this isn't about Flex good or bad, just that an easy commute at a legacy is going to be vastly better than what we do most of the time and will pay vastly more- especially in retirement contributions. Suck up the commute- it will be worth it in the long run and probably better as soon as you can hold a line at the majors.

 

There’s a train even from MCO to MIA 3.5hrs for $60.
Once you’re off probation buy a little place in MIA and bid Reserve.

 

United has a base in MCO. Might take a bit to get there, but it will happen eventually.

I'd rather walk to Miami than work at a fractional for the rest of my career.

You could buy a first class round trip ticket to/from work, and your career earnings will still be exponentially higher at one of the airlines you mentioned vs a fractional.

You'd rather do a 7 day work block FOR THE REST OF YOUR CAREER, than a 45 min commute to MIA?

C'mon man.

 

I hope this doesn’t come off as a 121 vs fractional hate thread, but having done both I can weigh in on the UAL commute vs Flex.

1. Fractional flying is wildly diverse. We go places that are amazing, as well as places that are boring. We go all over the Americas, and you never know when you’ll get an overnight in St Lucia or Curaçao, or Dublin, or Reykjavik. You’ll get more nights in Teterboro than you want, too. I NEVER hear of a 121 pilot talking about their over nights.

2. We work long stretches, and then have long stretches off. I typically work 7 or 8 day rotations, with at least 6 days off. Every three months or so I’ll end up with a two week stretch off. In my 121 life, I did 4 day trips, and a few days off. I hated it. Going back and forth to the airport sucks. That being said, we don’t have secondary bid periods, trip dropping, or trip trading, so that flexibility isn’t necessarily there. There are ways around that, though.

3. We work long days. Every duty day is going to be 12 hours. You may not fly it all, but they need flexibility out of you. It’s not uncommon to fly 3-4 legs a day. I don’t particularly like that, but it’s not the end of the world. FL450 is smooth, and our flying is typically “gentlemen’s hours”. Ie 9-5ish. The occasional rare coast to coast redeye. It’s also not uncommon to get a down day in the middle of a rotation. Ie broke plane = sit in hotel and rest. Also, our fatigue policy is very good.

4. I know my schedule 6 months out. I don’t bid every month, and I can plan my life well ahead of time. Oh, and I didn’t work any holidays my first year. Worked half the holidays my second. That would never happen in a 121 carrier.

5. 121 is much easier from a physical working standpoint. Get in, turn left. Shut the engines off, get out and turn right. We have a lot more work to due before and after a flight.

6. 121 training is much, much better. More proactive, and more soft skills based. Ours is checking boxes.

7. Our pay is decent, but it does not match 121 legacy. Probably never will. It’s still a great paycheck, though. And we get a company credit card that pays for all of our meals. No limit.

8. No commuting. We airline to wherever we’re needed. I live on the west coast, so first and last day of the rotation is almost always an airline flight, and nothing more. East coast based pilots may get used on the go home day. Still, no standby commuting. We have 100+ domiciles, some of which are in really unique locations that I’m surprised they allow. That equates to a lower cost of living if desired (vs living in MIA or JFK).

im sure there’s other things. At the end of the day it comes down to the lifestyle you want. For me, I can’t stand mainline airport terminals and being just a number on a seniority list. I prefer the work and flying that fractional do. It’s a lot of fun, and the long stretches of days off are very refreshing.

 

What would pay be as a captain? Year 2 or 3?

 

The worst two days of my job are going to work and heading home on the airlines. Big terminals are terrible. You can easily see why if you had the money, you’d never go through them again.

Been here 3.5 years and in the Praetor now. No desire to ever change aircraft unless they let me fly the new G. 😄

 

Year 3 Captain on the Praetor it’s looking like $230k gross and I don’t try to work that hard.

 

AIrline crews get the random full security but often just use KCM. On w/b's you do the full security drill overseas. It's worth the w/b lifestyle for the occasional hassle. Working as a pilot is a different experience than being a passenger in a big terminal. You're sitting back in coach, the pilots are in a cockpit (except the 737) that has stand up heading room. Getting stiff? Just stand up and do some stretches.

Part 121 is a vastly easier job. With a 3 man crew you can walk up to a cold dark airplane and fly anywhere in the world in 30 minutes. Sometimes 20 minutes if thinks click well.

 

Never heard about a 121 guy talk about his layovers? Rome? London? Paris? Berlin? Dubrovnik? Madrid? Barcelona? Rio? Buenos Aires? Maui? Kona? Barbados? Antigua? St. Maarten? Athens? Zurich? Prague? Lisbon? I remember the guys that were part of the regular softball games in Hyde Park. There was a standing softball game and he'd bid that for his layover. Later on he becamea baseball coach in......Santiago, Chile! That was his layover gig.

We call guys 'Mayor' when they fly to one location a lot and know a lot of people. Walking in the terminal and the Customs people knew the FO by name, the car rental people, etc. He eventually ended up marrying one of the ticket agents.

In 121 you can choose to fly to a handful of cities, for decades, or fly to as many as you can. The ability to control one's life is much greater. I made more of my kids school, and after school, events than my wife and my wife had a part time job in our town. Coaching? Three days a week? Did that for two seasons as a junior line holder. One guy would bid the lousy SFO layover once a month. "I go see my parents and help them out for a day." Fly in on day 1, fly all nighter back on day 2. Maybe 30 hrs at his parents house? Not a bad gig if you live 2000 miles away. Another guy, fairly senior, said "I'll trade any trip for your weekend trips." Wife was a big shot lawyer. He'd fly Friday PM departures and return Sunday. He'd have the kids Monday until Friday afternoon. Wife would leave work early on Friday (3 ish?) to take charge of the kids.

W/b crews stay in the great cities of the world with a 24-30 hr layover, and most importantly, a SET schedule and NO company phone or contact. There's a LOT to do if you're so inclined. Double layover? All bets are off as the options are vastly greater.

Some guys slam click and some guys have the entire day, Happy Hour and dinner planned out. Talking with a buddy and he mentioned an FO that I wasn't familiar with - "he's the coordinator. He always has the entire layover schedule planned out." Sometimes it's pre-planned, sometimes it's figured out enroute and sometimes it's pot luck.

Part 135, with a 2 hr call out once the 12 hr break is over, doesn't provide the opportunity that the airline's known time off on the layover provides. Part 135/91 there's a LOT of hanging around at the hotel or the FBO as the schedule morphs. Had an 8 day cycle - I think 18 cities were removed and 15 added. Impossible to plan to do anything and you're min breaking most layovers.

 

Yep, nailed it. Most fun I ever had was flying international and HI. But before that there were 30 hour layovers in YEG and YVR with skiiing and bike riding , long overnights in NYC where I could see plays or run in Central Park. Bike rides and surfing in SAN and SNA. Lots of things to do out of the flight deck. Some part 91s have this and more but 135? You work a lot. (Although I have had some extended overnights on charters).

To me, Flex and NetJets are like Southwest. You make the coin, but you pay the price by working harder. Some people are just fine with that and that’s okay.