Can you be more specific, what is wrong in that post? Seems pretty accurate to me.

 

It’s fairly accurate. Having worked at both a legacy and FJ I can say the 121 pilots not talking about their overnights is a comment made by either a regional pilot or someone who never accrued enough seniority to bid for the trips with great stays.

With regard to those stays the 121 world isn’t going to surprise you with a phone call at the end of your min rest with new trips.

Also, the 9-5 gentlemen’s trips are so far from reality in the frac world that I don’t know what to tell you. Get sucked into the Teterboro vortex and you’ll be wheels up before dawn as often as not. Less so if you manage to stay out west where the clients don’t march to the East coast work schedule.

 

so, what % of folks go from frax to major airlines versus the other way around (can’t include post 65 retirees)?

 

You mean you hear us Flexjet guys complaining how we only have time to rest on overnights? Give me a break, this is obviously a troll post or you are mental

 

This.

Any 121 pilot not talking about overnights or complaining about overnights is at a regional. Also, in general, the currency of conversation in the 121 world is how much money you make and how much time off you have. The currency of conversation in the frac world is the rare "awesome" overnight because everything else about the job sucks. The day-to-day is so unknown that when you get slapped with an awesome overnight, it is the best thing to happen to you all week on your trip. The airline world is nothing like that, and at my airline, I literally can't think of the worst layover in the system, as the hotel in that location will be pretty great, and it will be in an area where there is stuff to do and tons of food. Oh, and we will almost always have the time to actually do something with the layover.

 

All of this is subjective to who you work for and what they do... not all 121 is the same.
I never worked at the fractionals, but have workled at 9 different 121 airlines. Everything from Grand Canyon tours to a Major and also Cargo. At each one of them things were different, even though they are all 121 flying.
At a major, ya pay is great, nice hotels, nice layovers. but maybe not... I have friends at Hawaiian, they ended up on the 321 with trips to the west coast, and usually had min rest layovers. Lots of pilots avoid bidding it because the trips sucked. Or say you at United or AA or Delta,, well they only have a few domiciles. if you don't live near one you can hold, you will be a commuter. Or your airline moves your plane to a new domicile ( talk to 787 Hawaiian pilots) IMHO, anyone that says commuting is not bad, well you have not done it for a long time.
Even the best commute will add time away from home. Every commuter I flew with was always constantly checking their phone on the last day to see what time we would get back to base and when the last flight they could catch was. Sooner or later they all missed it and had to stay in a hotel...But then again, like one guy said, I don't care about the hassle of commuting because I live on a great property in MT.

Also, what one pilot says is great, another one says it sucks. For awhile I was doing a 17 day "trip". My Company would fly me to the base on day 1, and fly home on day 17,, got a hotel and per diem. ( basically TDY) then 13 days off every month. I liked that schedule, because on those days I did not fly all the time, maybe 10 -11 days at most. But others hated it and could not wait to stop doing it.

I flew with pilots in the cargo world that got furloughed or lost jobs during covid. They said they would never go back to PAX flying and having to deal with FAs and PAX and everthing else at the PAX flying companies. Flying cargo is very laid back.. Others did not like cargo because we flew mostly at night...

As for the comments that 121 guys could not handle the extra duties the fractional pilots do,, well I guess you guys did not fly at the regionals back when eveyone had 19 seat airplanes.
With no FAs and flying a hub a spoke system to all small airports with only 1 agent ,, as an FO you did everything the fractional guys do.. ( except handle the lav,, we didn't have one , LOL)
To me, flying at a fractional sounds like everything I did as an FO in my regional days.

 

And you're ok doing that in your late 60's after flying widebody jets (or senior narrow body) making the most money you've ever made in your life at a flying job, to be the bottom of the totem pole working weekends and loading bags in a snow storm in Aspen?

Hey good on you, but when I'm done flying 121 at 65 or whatever they increase or decrease it to by my own health or financial success. I'll be in my Hawaiian shirt and new balances sipping a mai tai on a beach somewhere.

 

As they say “Whatever floats your boat” Way back when, when I was half the weight and had more hair, buddy of mine, were both expats, many time zones away from home. You know… bills to be paid, and what not, during massive layoffs after 9/11. We were pushing about 900 hours a year, back in the day.

We both came back to the states in 2016. He went on to a new career flying PC12s, and I to a 121 cargo carrier, combination desk job and pilot. Just before 65, I matriculated to the 142 world as a business jet instructor/TCE/SEF. Yeah, I had some ferry trips until COVID and MCAS put the skids on that. In 2018, my friend went on to a 135 operation flying small then transitioned into medium/large size cabin class business jets. Sometimes 2 legs to 6 legs a day. Sometimes with eager and less than eager F/Os. Just not my cup of tea.

Well we are just about a week and a few days from the 31st. He put a few more thousand hours in his logbook, and me? I guess less than 300. I’m with a 142 operations and he’s gonna hang up the goggles on his Christmas tree when he gets home. He loved every minute of the 135 operation he’s with… and wouldn’t change a dang thing. Same with me. Our own cup of tea, I guess.

I don’t judge, nor give advice… especially when it’s unsolicited. We are capable of making our own choices.. retire or embark on a different path. Some have a passion to fly regardless of age, jets or PA-18’s. Some are happy to be home, every night, in the same time zone and some well you got the picture. Live and let live folks…. That’s my unsolicited advice.

Happy Holidays and a Healthy New Year.

 

Having worked corporate, fractional & now at a legacy carrier, the corporate job overseas was the most fun...but it was a job not a career. Airplane got sold and I was on the street just like that. My short stint at a fractional in the US made me miss 121 and that's when I began applying. Personally for me, the legacy gig is light years better than any flying out there. Just the sheer flexibility of it. For instance, holding 19 days off, with the ability to drop trips at will. Long layovers in specific cities. The ability to stitch together 20+ days off in a row at will.The only down side to the legacy gig is the lack of hotel stay credit/ points. That's the only thing I'd want from my 91/135 flying.
I would love to say different gigs suit different pilots, but a Legacy airline gig (not regional, not LCC) is light years better than any flying job as a career.