de727ups

"i just think a paid first officer should not be looked down on just because some other guy worked at a FBO for the last 3 years flight instructing."

I disagree. So do the rest of the people answering your question, here.

These are people in the industry. I can't even say they are your peers because you're not in the industry. They are your peer wannabes. They are right on the money. Of course, the final choice is yours.

pilot77

Thanks for all the help and information, i guess i will be going the cfi route.

HSLD

No. Relative to the majority of all working airlines, I'd venture to say that very very few working pilots paid that much for flight training if they paid at all.

Despite what the pilot mills tell you, there is no quick fix for a piloting career. Sure, in 90 days you can jump through the hoops and learn the right answers to an oral question or fly a predictable profile for a check ride - but don't confuse this as being the same as aeronautical experience. As you finish the course from a pilot mill do you really, deep down inside really, think you have the experience to work in a 121 environment with 300 hours?

There are no shortcuts to experience. Comparing a 1000 hour King Air pilot and a 1000 CFI, I'll take the CFI any day. The CFI has the aeronautical knowledge AND the experience working with a variety of people. BTW, there is no such thing as a King Air SIC, it's certified single pilot, so your really describing a guy riding along as ballast to pad his/her log book.

Silver02ex

Ummmm no, my friends and I never paid to build any multi time. We got our multi commercial, 1200 TT and flew bank checks for a year.

cloudbuster

I have read many, many threads here about pay-your-dues and be a flight instructor to gain experience and the min. required flight time needed to send-off those resumes to the regionals. Teaching is a great profession, and I will guess (from my experience) only 30-40% of the flight instructors out there have their hearts in there jobs...so why do it? Well, you do it because you need TIME! I would rather have this individual go pay for the right seat rather than ride on students wallets anyway.

Since the main gripe is "Oh you have to pay-your-dues to be respected in the aviation community, so flight instruct," is just hog wash. This isn't 1960 anymore this is 2010 and the aviation industry is completely different. This thinking is just out of date and made by pilots who are complainers anyway. Either you want to fly or you don't? What the industry wants and needs are good pilots who want to be the best at what they do...they first live to fly! Look at the highly paid PIC from the Delta flight into Min. who was griping so much over money he jepordized the safety of the flight? In my opinion, if his heart isn't into flying anymore then leave.

I am not at all saying hire pilots because they just hand MGMT some money...NOT AT ALL. The pilot has to be qualified!

In these pay for training opportunities, pilots are NOT just given the job because they have money. They go through the same training as any other pilot...high quality Part 135 or Part 121 training. If they can't perform, then they don't fly...not exactly the same for flight instructors at least to a point anyway. The military doesn't believe in having pilots just log time to move to the next level. Most F16 pilots have or start with only 400hrs. I believe it's important to seek out high quality training, flying the biggest and fastes aircraft you can gain experience flying. How many hours of C-172 time does a pilot need to master this aircraft? You paid to fly the C-172 so what if you paid to fly the shorts 360?

Don't forget the pilot who does decide to pay for the right seat is probably flying freight (most of these programs are by freight companies...Gulfstream has one I know). It's hard work flying at night on instruments probably with no autopilot. The pilots fly and sit...it isn't fun and they do it to show they have the desire to advance. Some get moved around every month and don't have a place to live. Some pilots have lived in their cars until they can afford to rent an apt. because they are not getting paid...right? Plus, a lot of the freight FOs have even help load and unload the freight. Yes, these pilots are PAYING THEIR DUES and gaining experience no flight instructor could ever obtain. You fly in all the weather, at night in real IMC. If I am hiring, I choose the pilot who has this kind of experience.

Lastly, as my title states, "Safety is a consideration." Flight instructing in little aircraft (part 61 or part 141) just isn't as safe as flying part 135 or 121 ops or aircraft. Flight instructing for 700-800hrs in training aircraft at uncontrolled airports is higher risk of a mishap. (I think general aviation is safe, but again it is all in the law of averages...what about the other guy who hits you and now you can't pass a first-class medical??? Something to think about?) One mishap and your career can be over before you start? Why take the risk? A talented athlete uses this theroy all-the-time (especially if they are good like a good pilot).

Anyway new pilots with 400-500hrs, who have the money should look into a good first officer program. One thought is to obtain your CFI first! The CFI rating is looked at very highly by those who hire. This rating is not easy to obtain...the check-ride will be the hardest of them all. Then look into buliding time within a good first officer program, unless you really need to practice those turns-around-a-point on a nice sunny day...however some really need to, you decide?

geddy lee

Nice dead thread revival. Go away.

the King

CB: Not the way I'd want to start at APC...way to make a splash...

PS. Dredging up threads from 2 and a half years ago is no bueno. Someone want to lock this one down?

GrUpGrDn

Its all a moot point anyway, congress will see to it that to step into a part 121 a/c, an ATP will be required by all flight crew. I hope so. Now let the thread go back to slumber land.

rickair7777

I suspect cloudbuster is manager/salesman for one of those programs where you pay to log "SIC" in an airplane which is only certified for a single-pilot

No need to lock the thread, it is still relevant today, especially with hints of possible airline hiring on the horizon.

SkyHigh

I have a friend who was a frustrated CFI and bought a FO job in a turbine twin. Six months later he got hired at Frontier and five years after that he upgraded to captain.

Pay to play is a risk. Relying on the natural job market to produce a similar job opportunity during hard times is a bigger risk.

I can not see how pilots and employers will ever know, or care, a few years down the road how you got your job. A pilot should use every resource that is at their disposal. Others eagerly usilise contacts or other advantages and no one seems to criticize them.

If all you have is money then buy a job. Do not let others talk you out of using a valid opportunity.

Skyhigh