Airline flying is what you make it. You can be a programmer if your want (for the most part). Anybody with any brains and skill won't. In the end, when things don't go your way, the programmer is going to be in big trouble.

I'll admit that it's harder to polish your flying skills in airline flying, but you can, and should, do it.

JMO,

Skydawg

 

Thinking is a dangerous thing for airline pilots. The plane might go down in flames but if the pilots are heard on the tape to be following procedures then no one can fault them. On the other hand if the captain taxi's into a ground cart because he failed to follow procedures and thought he had a better way then he has some answering to do.

We all can try harder but still the goal is to become exactly average and completely centered within the limits of the manual. There are no benefits to being better than the minimums set. It will not help you to advance or to be credited with saving a plane. Even if your non-procedural actions have a positive result the pilots will be faulted for not following the procedures.

SkyHigh

 

I routinely hand-fly departures up to 15K+

Most people turn off the A/P when configured and established on final, but I often start hand-flying some ways out with the airplane clean. You can normally have as much or as little fun as you want. Of course the A/P has to be on in the flight levels at most companies, but there's nothing going up there anyway.

 

Thanks...Thats what I'm looking for. I can't belive its as boring / mindless as Skyhigh always says it is...

Thanks again...

-LAFF

 

Skyhigh, I would hate to be your FO. If you operate as such that the FO does nothing but say "yessir" and program the box, then you are doing it contrary to EVERY airline cockpit I have ever been in. In the non-Skyhigh world we switch off between pilot flying (PF) and pilot not flying (PNF). As the PF it is up to you to either handfly or let the autopilot do the work (unless it is MELed in which case there is no choice). The PNF completes checklists that are called for, tunes radios if asked for, and talks on the radio. The PF can be either the CA or the FO, whoevers turn it is and you switch off so as to break up the duties 50/50. SOme switch at outstations, some at instations, and others have another method all together to determine where the switch is but there is a switch between PNF and PF. Take whatever Skyhigh says with an iceberg sized grain of salt because he is a little bitter. About the only good thing he said there was that the company wants you to follow procedure, but then that is true with any company in any field of work.

 

I am sure that things get a little more fun as the captain. You might get away with having the AP off a bit more. In addition a seasoned FO who is on friendly terms with the captain might also get away with some additional hands on flying, but nothing will erase the fact that at best it is all straight and level flying with a few shallow banked turns thrown in on VFR days. Some companies limit hands on flying severely.


Most modern jets are grounded if the AP is inop. You guys can attempt to glamorise it as much as you wish but you all know that I am right. Most of the time and especially when the chips are down the AP is on, you have very little control over things and the manual is always right. I doesn't take a Chuck Yeager to make it as an airline pilot. In fact the opposite is necessary.

SkyHigh

 

Even back to my probation days I never had to ask for permission to not use the autopilot. If I wanted to hand fly I would just have to simply not engage the autopilot. No getting away with anything. I still hand fly up to atleast an intermediate level off, and usually higher before letting Otto take over. It gets turned off on descent too. Doesn't matter if it is VFR or IFR. I can leave it off the whole trip if I'm not too lazy (but usually am). Most of the guys I fly with operate the same way.

You are correct that most airline flying is straight and level with some shallow banked turns, but then again, all instrument flying is mostly just straight and level with some shallow banked turns, no matter what or who you are flying for. It just so happens 121 flying is always instrument flying because you are always on an insrument cross country, even ig it is VFR.

I'm sure that I am not the only one who can hand fly until thier heart's content. You must have had some really bad captains at your old flying job if you werent even allowed to keep your flying skills current. I encourage everyone to handfly as much as possible because if the box breaks its up to you. The sharper you skills the better off you are.

 

I'll grant you that the companies I worked for were restrictive, but as you advance to larger more fancy planes you will see less and less hand flying. International heavy pilots are lucky to get three landings in a month. Both the airlines I worked for required the use of AP at certain points. What the real question was is how much is it used during IFR and emergencies.

Over all it can be said with certainty that there is no other form of aviation that offers less responsibility, satisfaction and control than the airlines. The entire system is designed to minimise pilot input and control. You fly the same aircraft type to the same handful of airports on the same routes using the same procedures day in and day out. It is an unending string of 25 degree banked turns from ILS to ILS. Every pilot function is carefully scripted and cataloged in the manual. Every decision is made for you or is guided through the manual. The aircraft is flown through computer inputs that are closely monitored by both bored pilots. McDonalds and Burgerking would be proud.

Soon the flight deck will be a flat panel of celluloid contact switches. When cleared for an approach the pilot will read back and punch the "ILS" button with fries.

To those of you who think I am joking. I wish I was.


SkyHigh

 

"Most modern jets are grounded if the AP is inop"

This is incorrect. You should know better coming off the 757. Or, you're just stirring up the pot...

The 727 (not modern), 757 and 767 (modern, I think) can all be flown with an inop autopilot. I've seen it done. Now a days, you'd have to stay out of RVSM airspace, though.

 

It might have been our company op specs then. We had captains who diverted if both computers went down.

It is easy to pick apart details of what I write. I admit that I have a error now and then but my main points are untouched. Pilots today fly the computer 98% of the time. It is what is taught in the sim and it is the way the future is going. You definitely will not see any less automation as time goes on. I doubt you could get a captain to accept a transatlantic flight without a functioning AP.

SkyHigh