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Solo in 25 hours. Ouch!

Old 01-26-2007, 03:33 AM
  #81  
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Originally Posted by Puppyz View Post
hahaha damn this is getting ridiculous
There is nothing ridiculous about a lively debate without name calling / making it personal. This forum needs more threads like this one.

-LAFF
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Old 01-26-2007, 08:53 AM
  #82  
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Originally Posted by LAfrequentflyer View Post
Thank you for writing the above statement. You have to work hard and pass at min. time - which is all that is required by the FAA to be awarded your ratings. There is no need to be logging anything beyond the published FAA mins for flight training. Doing so is a waste of your money.

-LAFF
Are you saying that iall students are ready to pass their checkride once they hit the minimum time required?? Or that if you aren't ready you should not pursue flying?? The average time nation-wide is atleast 10-20 hours over the minimum.

I completely disagree that there is no need to log anything past the FAA minimums. There is a learning curve, and there are plataus in flight training, not everyone is alike and therefore not everyone will get everything the first time through. Very few people get through without getting stuck somewhere along the line. There will be things that will take you longer to learn, and some things you will get right away.

To get everything in on minimum time is not always a good thing, you learn alot more when you make mistakes, then when you get it right the first time.

Not true. The FAA and the industry value safety time as a legitimate way for pilots to hone their SA and communications skills. However, it all depends on the two pilots and how effectively they utilize their time in the air. As far as the FAA and industry are concerned the time is valuable.

-LAFF
I am not saying it is not legitimate. It is perfectly legal to log it. However, I do not believe it is of the same value as actually flying the aircraft. Its not bad to safety pilot every once and awhile, helps you to see things differently, observe, and learn. It is not the same as actually flying the cross-country, and I feel that you get more from doing the cross-country, then looking out the window for other aircraft. Just because it is legal doesn't make it a good choice, a newly rated instrument pilot, who has no actual time, can legally take off 0-0, fly in hard IMC for 3 hours and do a full approach down to minimums by himself, and with passengers if he wants, its all legal, but its not a good idea. I know that is a little different situation, but you seem to be caught up on if its legal then its ok.

I, personally, prefer to have well over half of my PIC XC time to be actual flying and not Safety Pilot time. Thats what my time is like, and that is what I have seen to work. I have yet to meet anyone who has half of their time being Safety Pilot time, but if I did it would definately raise some flags for me, but that is just me.

Last edited by NE_Pilot; 01-26-2007 at 09:03 AM.
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Old 01-26-2007, 09:23 AM
  #83  
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Originally Posted by NE_Pilot View Post
Are you saying that iall students are ready to pass their checkride once they hit the minimum time required?? Or that if you aren't ready you should not pursue flying?? The average time nation-wide is atleast 10-20 hours over the minimum.

I completely disagree that there is no need to log anything past the FAA minimums. There is a learning curve, and there are plataus in flight training, not everyone is alike and therefore not everyone will get everything the first time through. Very few people get through without getting stuck somewhere along the line. There will be things that will take you longer to learn, and some things you will get right away.

To get everything in on minimum time is not always a good thing, you learn alot more when you make mistakes, then when you get it right the first time.



I am not saying it is not legitimate. It is perfectly legal to log it. However, I do not believe it is of the same value as actually flying the aircraft. Its not bad to safety pilot every once and awhile, helps you to see things differently, observe, and learn. It is not the same as actually flying the cross-country, and I feel that you get more from doing the cross-country, then looking out the window for other aircraft. Just because it is legal doesn't make it a good choice, a newly rated instrument pilot, who has no actual time, can legally take off 0-0, fly in hard IMC for 3 hours and do a full approach down to minimums by himself, and with passengers if he wants, its all legal, but its not a good idea. I know that is a little different situation, but you seem to be caught up on if its legal then its ok.

I, personally, prefer to have well over half of my PIC XC time to be actual flying and not Safety Pilot time. Thats what my time is like, and that is what I have seen to work. I have yet to meet anyone who has half of their time being Safety Pilot time, but if I did it would definately raise some flags for me, but that is just me.
Thanks for your well thought out and passionate response.

Its obvious we have different views on flight training. I wish you all the best in your life.

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Old 01-26-2007, 09:29 AM
  #84  
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25 Hours is not that bad to solo.

I know a guy where I instructed to failed his Private Single 5 times. His Private Multi 3 times, and his instrument 4 times. There are worse out there than 25 hours to solo.

NOT A BIG DEAL WHATSOEVER.

ATP blows.
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Old 01-26-2007, 09:47 AM
  #85  
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Originally Posted by LAfrequentflyer View Post
Thanks for your well thought out and passionate response.

Its obvious we have different views on flight training. I wish you all the best in your life.

V/r,
LAFF

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The difference is NE_Pilot's views seem to come from real world experience, not glossy brochures.
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Old 01-26-2007, 09:52 AM
  #86  
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Originally Posted by Slice View Post
The difference is NE_Pilot's views seem to come from real world experience, not glossy brochures.
Mine also come from real world experience. They don't agree with yours- we've established this already so you feel compelled to take a jab from time to time.

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Old 01-26-2007, 10:05 AM
  #87  
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You don't even have any real experience with ATP. Infact most of your posts are just a bunch of bullsh!t backed up by no real knowledge of what you are talking about.
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Old 01-26-2007, 11:23 AM
  #88  
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Originally Posted by Puppyz View Post
You don't even have any real experience with ATP. Infact most of your posts are just a bunch of bullsh!t backed up by no real knowledge of what you are talking about.
Whats your point?

I've said it over and over againg - i have no experience with ATP except to have researched flight training options and found them to be a good / one of the better deals out there.

I also encourage people to do their own research and find the solution that works best for them...

BTW - thatnks for your posts...

-LAFF
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Old 01-26-2007, 12:05 PM
  #89  
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Originally Posted by Puppyz View Post
You don't even have any real experience with ATP. Infact most of your posts are just a bunch of bullsh!t backed up by no real knowledge of what you are talking about.
That is my point.

You keep bringing down the FBO and keep praising ATP. You have no idea what you are talking about. Just because you felt like 1 FBO gave u a hard time doesn't mean they are all bad. You have numerous times stated ''ATP is the only place to consider".
When it comes to quality of flight training you believe ATP is the best. Then you go and down experienced instructors thinking they are being paid to relive their glory days. Assuming they are out to rip off their students. Have you ever thought maybe they instruct for fun because they love to teach??? You say that learning anything more then the minimum required is a waste of money and time. You really have no idea what you are talking about.

Last edited by Puppyz; 01-26-2007 at 12:41 PM.
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Old 01-26-2007, 12:57 PM
  #90  
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Originally Posted by Puppyz View Post
That is my point.

You keep bringing down the FBO and keep praising ATP. You have no idea what you are talking about. Just because you felt like 1 FBO gave u a hard time doesn't mean they are all bad. You have numerous times stated ''ATP is the only place to consider".
When it comes to quality of flight training you believe ATP is the best. Then you go and down experienced instructors thinking they are being paid to relive their glory days. Assuming they are out to rip off their students. Have you ever thought maybe they instruct for fun because they love to teach??? You say that learning anything more then the minimum required is a waste of money and time. You really have no idea what you are talking about.
There are exceptions. However, most of the FBO CFIs will take you for a ride - its in their best interest. Thats how they make their money.

-LAFF
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