Paper logbook vs. E-Logbook
Paper logbook vs. E-Logbook
03-05-2007 | 02:21 PM
#3
Chief Jeppesen Updater
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 3,080
Likes: 0
From: Executive Transport Driver
I use an MS Excel spreadsheet that I configured to fit on an 8.5x11" piece of paper. It looks similar to the Jepp Pro Pilot logbook, with columns configured to my needs.
Haven't inked a logbook entry in about 6 years...
Haven't inked a logbook entry in about 6 years...
03-05-2007 | 03:27 PM
#5
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 197
Likes: 0
From: Flying a Desk
I'm pretty steamed right now.
My wife told me I could buy the nice binder and pages for LBP. I wanted to find something cheaper, but she said to just buy the "good stuff", so I did.
It all came in the mail on Friday, but I was on a trip and didn't get back until yesterday. So last night I start working on the whole thing.
I bought the mini logbook, the one that is sized about the same as the traditional Jepp professional logbook.
After running test page after test page to make sure everything looked kosher, I decided it was time to print the real thing. I printed all of the left-side pages first, put them in the proper order, and then printed all of the right side pages. At this point I've been working on this for about 3 hours.
But something's wrong. Why does page 75 only have 4 entries on it and page 76 has a full page? After closer examination, I found the following:
Left pages - 18 log entries
Right pages - 19 log entries
Are you kidding me? So I pulled it up on the screen again, and sure enough, there were 18 entries on the left pages and 19 on the right. Son of a.... Actually, the words were a bit more colorful than that. I think I woke the neighbors at midnight last night.
So of course I send the info in to LBP support. I told them the situation, and I said that I was sending them the info to 1) keep it from happening to anyone else, and 2) possibly get a free pack of paper to try again since LBP was causing the problem.
Their response
Say what? I have to edit my registry to print? I've never tried to print before, so what could've screwed up my registry so badly that I would need to edit it? It sounds like a software defect to me.
My response:
Their 2nd response:
Lesson learned. I own LBP, the Pocket PC edition, the APDL, and now a $100 binder. If you plan on printing from LBP, make sure you check out the preview and make sure that the number of log entries is the same for both left and right pages. You would think the program would do that for you automatically, but apparently not. And apparently it requires a registry edit to fix.
My wife told me I could buy the nice binder and pages for LBP. I wanted to find something cheaper, but she said to just buy the "good stuff", so I did.
It all came in the mail on Friday, but I was on a trip and didn't get back until yesterday. So last night I start working on the whole thing.
I bought the mini logbook, the one that is sized about the same as the traditional Jepp professional logbook.
After running test page after test page to make sure everything looked kosher, I decided it was time to print the real thing. I printed all of the left-side pages first, put them in the proper order, and then printed all of the right side pages. At this point I've been working on this for about 3 hours.
But something's wrong. Why does page 75 only have 4 entries on it and page 76 has a full page? After closer examination, I found the following:
Left pages - 18 log entries
Right pages - 19 log entries
Are you kidding me? So I pulled it up on the screen again, and sure enough, there were 18 entries on the left pages and 19 on the right. Son of a.... Actually, the words were a bit more colorful than that. I think I woke the neighbors at midnight last night.
So of course I send the info in to LBP support. I told them the situation, and I said that I was sending them the info to 1) keep it from happening to anyone else, and 2) possibly get a free pack of paper to try again since LBP was causing the problem.
Their response
Originally Posted by LBP support
Hello,
It sounds like you have the margins out of sync which caused your issue. You can reset your margin information by following the steps below:
-Click start...run and type in REGEDIT, press okay to get into the registry editor
-Expand HKEY_CURRENT_USER
-Expand Software
-Expand VB and VBA Program Settings
-Find any entries on the left with "Logbook Pro" in the text, right-click and delete each one
-Close the registry editor
I'm sorry but we cannot provide replacement paper for situations like this as it is the users responsibility to preview the report as presented on screen, which is exactly how it will print, and/or print a test using draft paper prior to using the purchased paper. If you'd like us to print the logbook solution for you, we have a new turn-key printing service available.
Please see the following URL for details regarding our turn-key printing service:
http://secure.nc-software.com/Turn-k...s-P113C25.aspx
Let me know if I can be of any further assistance.
--------------------------
Sincerely,
Neal Culiner
NC Software, Inc.
http://www.nc-software.com
It sounds like you have the margins out of sync which caused your issue. You can reset your margin information by following the steps below:
-Click start...run and type in REGEDIT, press okay to get into the registry editor
-Expand HKEY_CURRENT_USER
-Expand Software
-Expand VB and VBA Program Settings
-Find any entries on the left with "Logbook Pro" in the text, right-click and delete each one
-Close the registry editor
I'm sorry but we cannot provide replacement paper for situations like this as it is the users responsibility to preview the report as presented on screen, which is exactly how it will print, and/or print a test using draft paper prior to using the purchased paper. If you'd like us to print the logbook solution for you, we have a new turn-key printing service available.
Please see the following URL for details regarding our turn-key printing service:
http://secure.nc-software.com/Turn-k...s-P113C25.aspx
Let me know if I can be of any further assistance.
--------------------------
Sincerely,
Neal Culiner
NC Software, Inc.
http://www.nc-software.com
My response:
Honestly, you’re saying that editing the registry, which is a major windows function, is the solution here?
It sounds to me like this is a product defect. I should never have to do a registry edit to fix a program function. That’s akin to heart surgery on my computer, as one slip could make the situation un-repairable. I’ve never tried to print the logbook before, so having to do this before printing it the first time is definitely a product defect.
I did preview the report. Obviously not well enough. I didn’t realize I’d have to count the number of entries on each page to make sure that they were the same. That is a little beyond what the average user should have to do.
Keep in mind what you’re doing here. Out of good will and in the spirit of customer service, a good business would take care of a loyal, 5-year, 4-product customer. If this is the way you take care of your customers, so be it. Looks like it’ll be time for me to find a new product to recommend to friends, students, and colleagues.
And by the way, your turn-key printing service is a joke. If I have been flying for 50 years and want to print out my logbook, maybe then I could justify the cost. I have many friends that use the program that would rather spend the hours required to transpose their logbooks to traditional paper than spend the money on your “service”. At this point, I’ll be one of them, as I can’t justify the money on additional logbook pages when the program doesn’t print correctly as is.
It would’ve been really nice if, as a gesture of good customer service, you could’ve sent me a complimentary pack of pages.
It sounds to me like this is a product defect. I should never have to do a registry edit to fix a program function. That’s akin to heart surgery on my computer, as one slip could make the situation un-repairable. I’ve never tried to print the logbook before, so having to do this before printing it the first time is definitely a product defect.
I did preview the report. Obviously not well enough. I didn’t realize I’d have to count the number of entries on each page to make sure that they were the same. That is a little beyond what the average user should have to do.
Keep in mind what you’re doing here. Out of good will and in the spirit of customer service, a good business would take care of a loyal, 5-year, 4-product customer. If this is the way you take care of your customers, so be it. Looks like it’ll be time for me to find a new product to recommend to friends, students, and colleagues.
And by the way, your turn-key printing service is a joke. If I have been flying for 50 years and want to print out my logbook, maybe then I could justify the cost. I have many friends that use the program that would rather spend the hours required to transpose their logbooks to traditional paper than spend the money on your “service”. At this point, I’ll be one of them, as I can’t justify the money on additional logbook pages when the program doesn’t print correctly as is.
It would’ve been really nice if, as a gesture of good customer service, you could’ve sent me a complimentary pack of pages.
Originally Posted by LBP Support
Hello,
If you follow the specific instructions, there is no harm that can be done to your computer. There is an alternative option, simply select the preferences/options icon when previewing your report and choose the reset page layout menu option. See the attached screen shot of the menu option you'll need to click.
Let me know if I can be of any further assistance.
--------------------------
Sincerely,
Neal Culiner
NC Software, Inc.
http://www.nc-software.com
If you follow the specific instructions, there is no harm that can be done to your computer. There is an alternative option, simply select the preferences/options icon when previewing your report and choose the reset page layout menu option. See the attached screen shot of the menu option you'll need to click.
Let me know if I can be of any further assistance.
--------------------------
Sincerely,
Neal Culiner
NC Software, Inc.
http://www.nc-software.com
Lesson learned. I own LBP, the Pocket PC edition, the APDL, and now a $100 binder. If you plan on printing from LBP, make sure you check out the preview and make sure that the number of log entries is the same for both left and right pages. You would think the program would do that for you automatically, but apparently not. And apparently it requires a registry edit to fix.
03-06-2007 | 02:01 AM
#7
Line Holder
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 47
Likes: 0
Quick related question. Down loaded LBP to replace my older Jepp FliteLog software. Got every thing into LBP no prob. I haven't put any thing into my paper log in like 3 years. If I interview with some one, is it acceptable to put all my endorsements on a blank page in the back of my printed log? I would hate to spend the money on a nice binder and paper only to have to bring my old crappy log. I got rid of the paper one for a reason. Or do I need to even bring my endorsements.
03-06-2007 | 05:32 AM
#9
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 259
Likes: 0
My interview experience with the "Pretty" Logbook
I have a nice printed leather binder logbook, which I spent a few hours getting perfect before I began interviewing a few years ago. I was so proud of the thing, but when I got to my 1st interview with it, the Chief Pilot wouldn't so much as open it. He wanted to see my Actual handwritten logbooks, from the time of my first training until present. I brought my paper versions as well, so it was no issue, but he had no interest in the pretty logbook, and I don't believe he would have further considered me until I could produce them. Luckily, I still update and maintain both versions, as you never know what may happen with the computer. I believe that he wanted to see all of the endorsements, and the original instructor signatures from your training, which you really cannot have in your printed one. Another issue with the computer version is the ease of adding logbook entries in the past that weren't there in the originals. (padding the computer book is far to easy) I know of many companies that specify the need for you to present ALL logbooks, so I would be careful with just maintaining a computer version.
03-06-2007 | 05:47 AM
#10
Chief Jeppesen Updater
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 3,080
Likes: 0
From: Executive Transport Driver
skycowboy,
I back my logbook up to several places, including hard copy (printout). I've formatted each sheet to look just like a logbook page and fit onto an 8.5"x11" sheet. When I fill up 2-3 sheets, I print them out in color, sign the bottom, and put them into a 3 ring binder in sheet protectors.
Instructor endorsements from my annual recurrent at FSI go onto avery stickers, and are stuck to a supplemental sheet at the back of the logbook. Obviously the computerized log doesn't have endorsements from my training days, so when I interview, I take that logbook along, as well as my 1 professional Jepp log that I used when I was instructing.
Sure, is it easy to stick an extra hour or three into a computerized log? Sure- but no easier than it is to write one into a paper log. Anybody that fails to see that, IMHO, just doesn't get it. It's not the type of log that a pilot keeps that determines whether they will be honest or not. It's the type of PILOT.
It's the ease of adding a computerized log that makes them so useful. When I transferred my times to my spreadsheet, I found over 50 computational errors. Most of them were in my favor (although one or two dropped a column total).
I'm more than willing to sho a prospective employer what I have (both paper and electronic). I know for a fact that it's good enough for the Feds. If that isn't good enough for a prospective employer, I don't know that it's an operation that I want to work for... if they get all bent out of shape about an electronic logbook, who knows what other type of BS is around the corner...
(FWIW, the past two corporate/charter interviews that I've had didn't even bother looking at my logbooks when I interviewed. They just wanted copies of my certificates.)
I back my logbook up to several places, including hard copy (printout). I've formatted each sheet to look just like a logbook page and fit onto an 8.5"x11" sheet. When I fill up 2-3 sheets, I print them out in color, sign the bottom, and put them into a 3 ring binder in sheet protectors.
Instructor endorsements from my annual recurrent at FSI go onto avery stickers, and are stuck to a supplemental sheet at the back of the logbook. Obviously the computerized log doesn't have endorsements from my training days, so when I interview, I take that logbook along, as well as my 1 professional Jepp log that I used when I was instructing.
Another issue with the computer version is the ease of adding logbook entries in the past that weren't there in the originals. (padding the computer book is far to easy)
It's the ease of adding a computerized log that makes them so useful. When I transferred my times to my spreadsheet, I found over 50 computational errors. Most of them were in my favor (although one or two dropped a column total).
I'm more than willing to sho a prospective employer what I have (both paper and electronic). I know for a fact that it's good enough for the Feds. If that isn't good enough for a prospective employer, I don't know that it's an operation that I want to work for... if they get all bent out of shape about an electronic logbook, who knows what other type of BS is around the corner...
(FWIW, the past two corporate/charter interviews that I've had didn't even bother looking at my logbooks when I interviewed. They just wanted copies of my certificates.)
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